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mbull
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:06 am | 1st Post |
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I've got a huge problem and need some advise.
I bought a 1983 Honda goldwing aspencade with 31240 miles on it that I put in a shop for brake repair and new tires. The shop also informed me I had a bent exaust valve on the left side (altho it was running fine when left with them). I however approved the repair.
Now the HUGE problem starts.
When I got it back it didn't run right and was spitting and sputtering. They informed me that it would run better after it warmed up. I rode it for around 40 miles and was so digusted I just parked it. The next day I tried it again and rode it for another 10 miles and the engine locked up. I returned it to the same shop and was told an intake valve on the left side had broke and busted the piston. (This is the same side they worked one to replace the bent exhaust valve.) They said it was due to the intake valve sticking open due to the bike sitting up too long and also using unleaded fuel. I had filled it up with 93 octane shell gas before starting my ride.
Can anyone tell me if this could be the reasons for the valve to hit the piston or would it most likely be the timing not being properly set correct when they repaired it, as I think? Also the timing belts were replaced last year with new ones. The bike sat up for 16 months and was not ridden until they rode it to test drive after repair.
Any ideas on this????
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Just winging it day to day.
Bought my first goldwing 3 years ago. I now own two!!!
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exavid
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:14 am | 2nd Post |
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 Welcome to the World's Greatest Goldwing Site mbull!
Sorry to hear about your bike's damage. About the only way valves can be damaged like that is to be mistimed or a bit of rust or corrosion on the valve stems from sitting around a long time in a damp area especially outside. If moisture gets into the engine during storage it's possible the valve stems might devlop corrosion on the part of the stem that's not covered by the guide. When the cam causes the valve to move in or out the corrosion can jam the valve enough that the spring can't pull it back closed. That will cause a piston strike. By far the most common reason for a damged piston or valve is mistiming of the cam belts. Why did the shop even start the engine if they were just doing a brake and tire job. As for using unleaded fuel that's a crock because you can't get leaded fuel, it's all unleaded at least in the US and Canada, don't know where you hail from without you putting your location in your profile.
If it were my bike I'd be taking on the shop that did the job. Did you have any reason to think there was a problem before they began the brake and tire change? I'd take them to small claims court if they wouldn't make it good.
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SC
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:19 am | 3rd Post |
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Last edited on Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:20 am by SC
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hatchetman
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:24 am | 4th Post |
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Hi Mbull. Welcome to the forum. running unleaded gas is your only choice because that is all that is sold now. I run regular octane and my bike likes it fine. Some guy's run high octane and they have no problems.
Getting to your bike. If they pulled the head off because you had a bent exhaust valve, you would have felt a lack of power as well as a crappy idle. Although you can cruise at 60 miles per hour on 3 cylinders easily, you would have noticed it running crappy on hills and gearing down alot would be the only way to keep up your speed on a hill.
If they pulled the head off due to a bent valve, A good mechanic would have checked the other ones for signs of trouble. the fact that it ran worse when you got it back, should be arguement enough to have them fix it at no charge as they obviously did not do it properly the first time.
Piston damaged means you spend alot of money and time splitting the case or you find a used engine and call it a day.
Not really good news for you!
Others will give you advise or tips that may help you get back on the road.
Keep us all posted as to what happens next.
Dont give up on your wing yet, They are amazing when running right!
Wayne.
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MDKramer
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 06:23 am | 5th Post |
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I'd say that if it ran fine when you dropped it off, and it ran worse when you picked it up, the shop "found" something to gouge you for, and it's backfired on them.
Give them an alternative, since it was their "repair" that cut loose and destroyed your engine, they can cover all damages incurred...or face a lawyer.
Mike
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Mike Kramer
Proudly supporting Viet Nam Vets and Legacy Vets M/C
Red is for the blood shed Black is for the mourning
Been riding that 1980 beauty to the left since 1989
Helpful Hint: Traffic lights timed for 35mph are also timed for 70, 105, and 140!
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ob1quixote
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 12:12 pm | 6th Post |
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So, you take the bike in for brakes and tires. Later, they call you to tell you there is a bent exhaust valve?
Exactly how do they find this out while servicing the tires and/or brakes?
I would be looking for bits of burnt rubber inside the rear fender, I'm guessing they decided to do a burn-out with your bike, and lost a cam belt.
Best of luck, it sounds like you have a problem with a disreputable shop.
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RB
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 02:01 pm | 7th Post |
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I'd say they Screwed up. Unless they are use to working on GL's doing the belts wrong is a very common mistake and costly..as it leads to bent valves and hole pistons..time for small claims court.
Did you drive it to the shop? Did it run Ok goign in? Do you have any witnesses to it's running OK?
Post your location in youir profile maybe someone local can help you.
____________________
1981 GL1100I Daily rider
1976 GL1000 Sulfur Yellow barn find
1979 GL1000 parting out..PM if you're looking for something
1975 sold
1978 sold
1981 sold
1982 sold
FAIR WINDS,
RB
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dan filipi
Senior Guru
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 03:55 pm | 8th Post |
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The bike sat up for 16 months and was not ridden until they rode it to test drive after repair.
I wouldnt be so quick to sue the shop. We all know these bikes have problems after sitting for a long time. There at are least 2 cases here in the last year of a valve sticking and contacting the head.
Granted, a "good" mechanic would have done a complete check of all the valves on that same head but it sounds like a case of your word against theirs at this point.
This is one reason many of us do our own repairs.
I'm interested to know how they knew an exhaust valve was leaking, and how they now know it's a intake that caused the lockup.
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sandiegobrass
Senior Guru
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:55 pm | 9th Post |
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Sorry for the engine damage... that is a bummer... I thnk the mechanic could have been negligent, but from what I read, that would be hard to prove... If one valve stuck, it is possible that others did later... I think the tire burnout suggestion is not worth considering.. But, I would insist on my money back on the valve repair simply on principle... their repair did not work .. If there is piston damage, you are probably better off finding another engine.. rebuilding it is not out of the question, but parts alone will be far more than a good used one....Last edited on Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:56 pm by sandiegobrass
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ob1quixote
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 06:16 pm | 10th Post |
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Well, burnouts aside, the question of how one diagnoses a bent valve through tire or brake service is quite valid.
Lends one to wonder what they were doing looking at the valves...I would find it hard to believe that most {or any} shops inspect the valve train of their service jobs, unless the disassembly for the work requested requires it.
Tires and brakes do not.
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mbull
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 03:15 am | 11th Post |
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WOW!!! What a wonderful site. I never expected so many great replys and welcomes.
I really don't know how they got to the bent valve. I called and asked when my bike would be ready for pick-up from the brake and tire job and they told me I had a problem.... there was no compression on the left bank... I just figured they discovered it while test driving?? I went ahead and approved the repair because i'm ignorant when it comes to machanics and have to trust the shop.
The repair estimate from them is $2155.28 so I have already purchased another engine on ebay and plan to have it installed by a different shop.. if I can find one around Fayetteville Tennessee that will do it. I had a problem finding anyone local that wanted to work on the brakes to begin with and this shop was the only one that would.
I also asked them if they felt any responsibility for this damage but they said no. I have done some research on this and it's all been mixed just like the opinions here.
I love the bike and will keep it on the road as long as I can still throw my 60 year old leg across it.
I really do want to thank all you guys for the warm welcome to the site and will keep you posted on the outcome and maybe post a few photos of the aspencade also!!!
Thanks again
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Just winging it day to day.
Bought my first goldwing 3 years ago. I now own two!!!
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MDKramer
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 03:23 am | 12th Post |
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So YOU'RE the one who bought the '83 engine I had my eye on as my next winter project.
Well, at least it went somewhere that it was truly needed. 
Mike
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Mike Kramer
Proudly supporting Viet Nam Vets and Legacy Vets M/C
Red is for the blood shed Black is for the mourning
Been riding that 1980 beauty to the left since 1989
Helpful Hint: Traffic lights timed for 35mph are also timed for 70, 105, and 140!
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jimsjinx
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 03:47 am | 13th Post |
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| Too bad we're gettin old, you could just take it out of the mechanic's backside!!Oh well,coulda been worse I guess.I'm sorry this happened to you.Why is it that the best motorcycle in the world has the worst luck with shops.Honda or private.(?) Best wishes your way, and keep us posted! jimsjinx
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Broke Winger
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 03:55 am | 14th Post |
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We really ned to find a member close enough to you to came and help you do the engine swap in your own garage.
I am no mechanic but I just replaced te motor on my Wing about 1400 miles ago. I think it's been two months.
It really isn't all that complicated just time intensive. I think the hardes part is the lifting!.
I would very gladly come by and help you do it but yer a bit far from Milwaukee Wi.
Come on guys some has to be close enough to this guy to help him out!
Oh yeah one more thing....
Welcome to the Worlds Greatest Web Forum Last edited on Mon Aug 25th, 2008 03:56 am by Broke Winger
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mbull
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 04:13 am | 15th Post |
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Well I guess they could be correct on the cause after all but I think your advice on the court case may be the correct way to go. All the research i've done leans toward the timing. I just think they would have offered some kind of deal on the labor. I would have been willing to pay for the parts but they just want the $2155.28 to put in the pocket. One's thing's for sure... they won't get anymore business from me!!!
Thanks for the advice
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Just winging it day to day.
Bought my first goldwing 3 years ago. I now own two!!!
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mbull
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Posted: Tue Nov 4th, 2008 08:01 am | 16th Post |
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Well guys I guess i've gone bike crazy. I now have a 1980 GL1100 with 9897.7 miles on it. She's a black beautiful girl with a pair of vetter saddle bags (i like wide hips)vetter upper farings with non scratched windshield. Her skin is clean and shiny as is all the chrome. But as usual these garage finds have the sitting-up stuck carbs and brake calipers, so here comes the shop repair bills again. I also have bought two (2) Yamaha XJ 1100s and a 1985 Yamaha 700 with full vetter shield-radio, and just for kicks I bought a 1997 yamaha xj 125 scooter!!!etc; I'm ready to sell the scooter and the matched pair of Yamaha 550s along with the yamaha XJ 700. So if you know anyone who need one please send them my way.
As far as the engine repair for my aspencade I checked the two other dealer repair shops and they quoted anywhere from 10 hours minimum to 16 hours not to include things they may find in the process of installation but the shop that messed it up quoted me $300.00 to $350.00 for it. So I may have to stick my neck out and let him have a shot at it again and let him install the new engine. And when he gets it done ....I'LL SUE THE #%*%#@ OUT HIM FOR THE DAMAGE ON THE FIRST ENGINE.
jUST THOUGHT i WOULD KEEP YOU GUYS INFORMED.
MBULL
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Just winging it day to day.
Bought my first goldwing 3 years ago. I now own two!!!
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swampman
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Posted: Tue Nov 4th, 2008 12:27 pm | 17th Post |
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I am not sure that I would use this guy to replace the engine if you are planning on suing him. In the lawsuit you will be trying to prove that the mechanic didn't know what he was doing or he messed up some way. If you use him for another job then you will be telling the courts that you trusted him enough to let him do work for you again. Might hurt your case.
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Rumple
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Posted: Tue Nov 4th, 2008 12:53 pm | 18th Post |
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Was this a mom and pop shop that did the work for you or was it an authorized motor cycle dealership? Honda, Yamaha Harley, whatever?
It's possible to have a bent valve from years past when the timing belts were last replaced. But there is no excuse for the mechanic to not recondition the head before he reinstalled it. Meaning check out all the valves, replace the valve guide seals, and make sure they all were seated. Did this place give you back any of your old parts? How long did they have your bike? A couple days a couple weeks? Most places don't have older GL1100 parts sitting on the shelf, they would have to be ordered, that takes time.
I agree, if it was running when it whent in it should be running the same or better when it came out. Then to tell you it would be better after it warmed up. What a bunch of crap. I'd sue the hell out of them and never let them work on anything of mine again, no matter what kind of a"good deal" they would give me.
Check around there should be someone from here on this forum, close by to help you or you take it to them.
Later Rumple
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jrward
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Posted: Tue Nov 4th, 2008 01:43 pm | 19th Post |
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| I've had this exact problem. I was hauling down the road the day before at 90 MPH and the next day went for a scoot. I got a quarter mile from the house and "CLACK", bumped the starter and nothing. After pushing back to the house, I pulled the spark plugs and there it was. #4 piston had a hole punched in it when the exhaust valve hung and the piston came up to say hello. Aluminum always loses.
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JBz
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Posted: Tue Nov 4th, 2008 01:58 pm | 20th Post |
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| the front water pump cover has to be changed out if you want your gear indicator to work. i dont know if i would trust them doing that. jb
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2003 yamaha vstar 1100 classic 2004 honda rebel 250 {2}1983 aspencades + 83 Interstate 82 Aspencade 77 gl 1000 81 gl 1100 standard {2}1981 Interstates 78 gl1000
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