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Wichita Scorpion
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Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2007 07:35 am | 21st Post |
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I can't figure out how to put more than one picture on the reply. Attachment: Switch Mount 2.jpg (Downloaded 120 times)
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Wineberry-1989 Goldwing GL 1500
Wineberry/Brown-1983 Goldwing GL 1100A with 1983 Wineberry/Brown-California Sidecar
Keith
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Wichita Scorpion
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Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2007 07:38 am | 22nd Post |
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| Mounted on 1983 GL 1100A Attachment: Switch Mount 3.jpg (Downloaded 83 times)
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Wineberry-1989 Goldwing GL 1500
Wineberry/Brown-1983 Goldwing GL 1100A with 1983 Wineberry/Brown-California Sidecar
Keith
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sandiegobrass
Senior Guru
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Posted: Wed Oct 3rd, 2007 02:25 pm | 23rd Post |
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Wichita Scorpion wrote: ...
Switch settings: 1-on, 2-off, (low); 3-off, 4-on, 5-off, 6-on, (9650); 7-on, 8-off, 9-off, (4 cyl low) 10-on, (Sq Wave); 11-off, (Manual); 12-off, (open).....
Sounds great... Your gain is much higher than I would expect to work with the short pull on the bar linkage, but that might be due to the larger resistance with the side car.. Have you tried it at slower speeds.. say 50 mph? and I am curious why you used the "manual" setting? Are you not using the neutral switch? It was my understanding from the instructions and talking to Rostra, that the setting had to be "automatic" for the neutral switch lt green wire (for clutch and neutral on the GL1100) to be active... Maybe that is my bad information... Does yours disengage the cruise when you pull in the clutch?
Nice custom bracket... nice metal work.... and I thought about putting the whole servo control unit in a box.. and actually made the box, but had trouble fitting it and by the time I had modified it to fit, I was so frustrated with how it looked, I threw it away and went without it...
Last edited on Wed Oct 3rd, 2007 03:22 pm by sandiegobrass
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SIGNUP FOR NASSIR 2 MONTROSE,CO SEPT 15,16,17, 2009
(GO HERE FOR INFO) then PM wexy to be put on the list.
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If a man speaks in the forest and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?
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SDB/Jim
2000 GL1500SE - 2008: 4.5k
1983 GL1100I - 2008: 4.5k
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Temporarily in Indiana
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Wichita Scorpion
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Posted: Thu Oct 4th, 2007 06:08 am | 24th Post |
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Hi sandiegobrass. We have used the cruise control at all speeds. Still need to check it out in different conditions, hills, etc. It has not been harsh or jerky for us. As you know it doesn't engage until around 35 mph. My son, the first day testing, had the cruise set at 40 mph and decreased it one mile per hour at a time all the way down to about 28 mph before it disengaged. I will be checking this later also. Yesterday after stopping at a stop sign, I accelerated to about 35 mph and hit the resume and the cruise control took us back to 55 mph smoothly. I was on a Parkway in Wichita Falls with the cruise set at 45 mph, speed limit is 45 mph, with stop lights about 1/4 mile or so apart. They have the lights set so that you get green if you do 45 mph from your first red. As you know this doesn't always work so naturally for a few of the lights, I had to slow ahead of time to pick up the green. When I hit the resume we accelerated back to 45 mph. The cruise control seems to be working well at all speeds for us. Not much difference operating than in my pickup or the caddie. Very well may be the added sidecar weight. We started with the 'extra low' gain setting on the first day and my son and I decided that the 'low' gain setting was us giving better operation.
Now, My Manual Setting with switch 1 & 2. All of what I am going to write on this subject you already know, it is for the benefit of others that might be thinking of installing a cruise control and might read this. All of my wiring connections are exactly the same as yours are, 'YOU DID GOOD WORK', except possibly for the grounding point for Ground (Black) wire and the TACH (Dark Blue) wire. Running the Loom over the shock allowed the Ground (Black) wire to be just long enough to connect it to the (over the fuel tank) right cross brace to frame bolt. I also ran the TACH wire back (from the Bulkhead connector) down the loom to ground at the same point, the right cross brace bolt. I could have used the accessory negative terminal on the main fuse box for ground for the TACH wire but decided it would be neater to run back down the loom and connect it to the frame. Also a frame ground is not passing through any connectors except the negative battery connection. We have too many wires in the bike front end now: For sidecar-fader controlled radio speakers, brake/tail lights, driving light, air horn, PTT switch, cigarette lighter/light, and headset connector. PO hooked up dash switch for emergency blinkers also.
My thinking on the Manual/Automatic Transmission setting:
Studied, wrote down, your switch settings. Studied, wrote down, tricky's switch settings. Studied the installation manual. I compared all three wiring connection write-ups. Tricky didn't use the Light Green Neutral Safety (NSS), not sure why not, but he did hook up the TACH wire to prevent overspeed. You grounded the TACH wire and used the NSS wire. I liked your 5 thoughts on why not to hook up the TACH wire. In the Installation Manual, it talks about an automatic transmission and the next paragraph talks about a manual transmission. Manual transmission Quote: "On a vehicle with a manual transmission, the TACH wire connection is not required only when CLUTCH DISENGAGEMENT SWITCH (Kit# 250-4206) has been installed." Unquote. I took that to mean that since you and I already have a clutch disengagement switch, NSS wire, hooked up that it doesn't matter which transmission is selected with the #1 and #2 switches. Since our Goldwings have Manual Transmission, I chose Manual. I did wonder why you chose Automatic but I didn't and still don't think it makes any difference.
One thing that I still want to check out. On our Goldwings, if in gear, the starter won't work until the clutch is almost completely depressed. If cruise control is set, at say 60 mph, and you or I pull the clutch slowly, as the clutch plates start to slip, will the engine start to over speed? Our first day of testing, my son mentioned to me that the clutch had to be fully depressed for the cruise to disengage, and that the GL 1500 disengages with just a touch of the clutch lever. I'm thinking, the GL 1500 must have two switches, one for the start function, and another one for the cruise control disengage. Need to look that up, the GL 1500 book is at my son's home. Anyway I am not worried about this since I can't think of any time I would slowly pull the clutch lever while flying down the road, or, anyway that I can get the transmission into neutral at above 33 mph without using the clutch. When slowing from higher speeds, I am always clutching, downshifting, and braking.
Interesting to see what your thoughts are on hooking up the TACH wire to prevent overspeed. As for me, I am about as happy as a pig in slop! Attachment: Wiring from Back-7x5.25.jpg (Downloaded 78 times)
____________________
Wineberry-1989 Goldwing GL 1500
Wineberry/Brown-1983 Goldwing GL 1100A with 1983 Wineberry/Brown-California Sidecar
Keith
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Wichita Scorpion
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Posted: Thu Oct 4th, 2007 06:14 am | 25th Post |
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| Servo mounting. Geezz, looks a lot like yours! Attachment: Servo Mounting 2-7x5.25.jpg (Downloaded 78 times)
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Wineberry-1989 Goldwing GL 1500
Wineberry/Brown-1983 Goldwing GL 1100A with 1983 Wineberry/Brown-California Sidecar
Keith
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Wichita Scorpion
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Posted: Thu Oct 4th, 2007 06:19 am | 26th Post |
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| Wiring at fuel tank and air box. Attachment: Wiring at Fuel Tank-Carbs-7x4.6.jpg (Downloaded 78 times)
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Wineberry-1989 Goldwing GL 1500
Wineberry/Brown-1983 Goldwing GL 1100A with 1983 Wineberry/Brown-California Sidecar
Keith
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sandiegobrass
Senior Guru
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Posted: Thu Oct 4th, 2007 03:54 pm | 27th Post |
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Wichita Scorpion wrote: ...Interesting to see what your thoughts are on hooking up the TACH wire to prevent overspeed. ...
My conclusion (not tested) was that the tach function would not work properly with the CDI ignition (regardless of the cc settings)... Based on my discussions with Rostra, it is expecting a rather clean pulsed or square wave signal as for example at specific, rather clean tach connections (for example at conventional Kettering points set-up or at electronic ignition pulse generators or at the ECU tach output). I have looked at the GL1100 coil primary voltage and it is a typical trashy CDI voltage (peaks at a couple hundred volts and oscillates as it decays in a few milliseconds) which I think would require a "tach filter" to make the blue wire hookup work properly... You can buy them (about 20 bucks) or I made one (2 bucks). I will post on that later... And it would be interesting to determine what the actual tach overspeed value is... I understand it is 4000 pulses (same as rpm for the GL1100), and that would work most of the time with the wing... But my primary interest is to use the filtered CDI voltage as input to the VSS (gray wire) so that other wing owners (without a VSS) could use the Rostra without the magnets. (More on that later too.)
Thanks for your pictures... I noticed you custom bracket to support the CPU/Servo unit... Make a few extras and probably someone would buy it.. 
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SIGNUP FOR NASSIR 2 MONTROSE,CO SEPT 15,16,17, 2009
(GO HERE FOR INFO) then PM wexy to be put on the list.
---------------
If a man speaks in the forest and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?
---------------
SDB/Jim
2000 GL1500SE - 2008: 4.5k
1983 GL1100I - 2008: 4.5k
---------------
Temporarily in Indiana
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sandiegobrass
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Posted: Thu Oct 4th, 2007 04:15 pm | 28th Post |
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Wichita Scorpion wrote: .. One thing that I still want to check out. On our Goldwings, if in gear, the starter won't work until the clutch is almost completely depressed. If cruise control is set, at say 60 mph, and you or I pull the clutch slowly, as the clutch plates start to slip, will the engine start to over speed? ...
I have never pulled th clutch in slowly to check.. I'll try that tonight on the way home.. I can't think of a time when I might normally do this either.. maybe slowly out, but slowly in? I do know that the cc will disengage with normal clutching for shifting gears; I've tried that.. give a slight blip in engine speed before disengaging.. And I think that you are correect, there must be two switches in the 1500.
Another feature of the 1500 is that forcing the throttle closed will disengage the cruise. In the future, I may add that feature to the 1100 as well... my method willl be to use a spring as part of my bead chain connector with a simple elecrical disconnect (inside the spring) in series with the brake lowside wire that opens when the spring begins to extend. This would allow me to override (and disengage) the cruise with the throttle.
____________________
SIGNUP FOR NASSIR 2 MONTROSE,CO SEPT 15,16,17, 2009
(GO HERE FOR INFO) then PM wexy to be put on the list.
---------------
If a man speaks in the forest and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?
---------------
SDB/Jim
2000 GL1500SE - 2008: 4.5k
1983 GL1100I - 2008: 4.5k
---------------
Temporarily in Indiana
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sandiegobrass
Senior Guru
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Posted: Fri Oct 5th, 2007 01:11 pm | 29th Post |
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sandiegobrass wrote: "...I have never pulled th clutch in slowly to check.. I'll try that tonight on the way home.. "
Tried it... the clutch does slip before the switch closes right about in the middle of the clutch throw... by just a mm or two.. I could probably put a little more play in the clutch and make the switch come first, but that would be defeating the function intended (prevent starting with drivetrain engaged), so I will leave it as is.. Jim
____________________
SIGNUP FOR NASSIR 2 MONTROSE,CO SEPT 15,16,17, 2009
(GO HERE FOR INFO) then PM wexy to be put on the list.
---------------
If a man speaks in the forest and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?
---------------
SDB/Jim
2000 GL1500SE - 2008: 4.5k
1983 GL1100I - 2008: 4.5k
---------------
Temporarily in Indiana
|
Wichita Scorpion
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Posted: Sat Oct 6th, 2007 05:09 am | 30th Post |
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I can't imagine any situation where you, me, or anyone else would slowly pull the clutch traveling above 33 mph. I think we are OK with the way you set everything up.
I did check some on the schematics for the GL 1500 Cruise Control. They have disable switches all over the place, one being on the clutch engaging just as you start to pull the clutch. There are two switches at the clutch lever. Also found it works on vacuum, didn't know that. Thanks for everything.
____________________
Wineberry-1989 Goldwing GL 1500
Wineberry/Brown-1983 Goldwing GL 1100A with 1983 Wineberry/Brown-California Sidecar
Keith
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sandiegobrass
Senior Guru
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Posted: Sat Oct 6th, 2007 11:08 pm | 31st Post |
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Wichita Scorpion wrote: ... Also found it works on vacuum,.....
Almost every factory cruise system uses vacuum.. not going to write a dissertation as to why, except to say that after studying this for a while, I came to the conclusion that a vacuum controlled servo is ideally suited for this type of application. If requires the simplest type of controller (open to vacuum if too slow, open to vent if too fast, closed if right on), it is inherently stable, and requires minimal tuning... If I were doing it again, I'd certainly try the vacuum... not that I don't like what I have.. I just need another research project... 
____________________
SIGNUP FOR NASSIR 2 MONTROSE,CO SEPT 15,16,17, 2009
(GO HERE FOR INFO) then PM wexy to be put on the list.
---------------
If a man speaks in the forest and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?
---------------
SDB/Jim
2000 GL1500SE - 2008: 4.5k
1983 GL1100I - 2008: 4.5k
---------------
Temporarily in Indiana
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Wichita Scorpion
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Posted: Fri Nov 16th, 2007 05:37 am | 32nd Post |
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 This is update on my 1983 GL 1100A Cruise Control installation. We haven't been on any long trips but have had time to check out the operation, slow, fast, up and down hills, level. I am very well satisfied with the way it operates. I did take the slack out at the arm connection and the Cruise engages as soon as I push the set, not a delay like before.
Couple other things:
1. I installed LEDs in place of incandescent bulbs in the Aspy and sidecar (tail, brake, turn). The Cruise would not engage until I put one incandescent tail/brake bulb back in the sidecar. May work on that later.
2. Since I had replaced an OEM bad turn signal relay with one recommended on this forum, locally available Tridon Stant EP 28, I found that it is compatible with the LEDs, works great.
Thanks again, sandiegobrass, for all your work, your help, and for posting the procedures on this forum.
____________________
Wineberry-1989 Goldwing GL 1500
Wineberry/Brown-1983 Goldwing GL 1100A with 1983 Wineberry/Brown-California Sidecar
Keith
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sandiegobrass
Senior Guru
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Posted: Fri Nov 16th, 2007 04:11 pm | 33rd Post |
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Wichita Scorpion wrote: 1. I installed LEDs in place of incandescent bulbs in the Aspy and sidecar (tail, brake, turn). The Cruise would not engage until I put one incandescent tail/brake bulb back in the sidecar. May work on that later.
Thank you.. incidently the LED stuff was covered in the installation pdf...... quote:
Violet wire - ... If you are using diode lamps instead of bulbs, you will have to add a normally closed relay that opens when the brakes are pressed.....
Jim Last edited on Fri Nov 16th, 2007 04:13 pm by sandiegobrass
____________________
SIGNUP FOR NASSIR 2 MONTROSE,CO SEPT 15,16,17, 2009
(GO HERE FOR INFO) then PM wexy to be put on the list.
---------------
If a man speaks in the forest and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?
---------------
SDB/Jim
2000 GL1500SE - 2008: 4.5k
1983 GL1100I - 2008: 4.5k
---------------
Temporarily in Indiana
|
sandiegobrass
Senior Guru
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Posted: Sat Aug 2nd, 2008 03:24 am | 34th Post |
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Just an up date... the Rostra unit on my GL1100 definitely works better than the OEM on my GL1500... and I have about 5000 miles on it now...I ride to work 35 miles each way.. almost all "freeway".... some hills... I prefer the GL1100 for the cruise... even though for just about everything else, the 1500 wins...
____________________
SIGNUP FOR NASSIR 2 MONTROSE,CO SEPT 15,16,17, 2009
(GO HERE FOR INFO) then PM wexy to be put on the list.
---------------
If a man speaks in the forest and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?
---------------
SDB/Jim
2000 GL1500SE - 2008: 4.5k
1983 GL1100I - 2008: 4.5k
---------------
Temporarily in Indiana
|
sandiegobrass
Senior Guru
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Posted: Thu Aug 21st, 2008 02:26 am | 35th Post |
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Quick note.. my hosting service has deleted all my files... they say they are restoring them.. so my links here should be restored soon.. Sorry for any inconvenience.. Jim
I am in theprocess of restoring them.. This thread should be up to date... PM if you see anything missing.. Jim
Last edited on Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:15 pm by sandiegobrass
____________________
SIGNUP FOR NASSIR 2 MONTROSE,CO SEPT 15,16,17, 2009
(GO HERE FOR INFO) then PM wexy to be put on the list.
---------------
If a man speaks in the forest and there is no woman to hear him, is he still wrong?
---------------
SDB/Jim
2000 GL1500SE - 2008: 4.5k
1983 GL1100I - 2008: 4.5k
---------------
Temporarily in Indiana
|
gmac78
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Posted: Mon Sep 8th, 2008 08:28 pm | 36th Post |
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| I have enjoyed all the info and great comments from all here.
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