| GL1200 charging circuit changes | Rate Topic |
| Moderators: redbaron, MDKramer, Flyone, AZgl1500 | Page: 1 2   |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 12:02 pm | 1st Post |
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Hello Everyone, I know this subject has been done to death. However, I've decided to start this post by way of a big thank you to Steve Saunders and all the members who make this site such a great source of technical information, not to mention an interesting read! When we recently bought a GL1200 Aspencade we did not know about the common charging circuit problem experienced by so many owners. Thanks to this forum I was able to read (and read, and read...) until I got the picture clear in my head about the likely cause and cure for our electrical woes. We live in Australia and purchased our wing, sight unseen, after several phone calls to the previous owners. They lived 900 kms away and we made the decision to take a bus trip and ride the bike home. Our problems began on the first day when the battery lost charge within a short period of time after picking up the bike. At the first fuel stop our battery was flat and I push started it just to get going again. During the course of the ride home just enough charge made it into the battery to allow us to get started after each fuel stop. After we arrived home the battery gave up and we didn't get another start until we got a new battery. Roadworthy and registration was the next detail. This led to having to strip the machine down far enough to change the valve stem seals to try to stop the smoke on cold start up. This was attended to and the bike was registered in my name. By now it was obvious that the circuit was not charging the battery as even the new battery was going dead. I took it out after dark one evening and soon found that the headlight would brighten up at first after take off then suddenly go dull. At each gear change the light would again go bright, but as soon as the revs picked up, dull !! I'll stop now and post this, then continue, otherwise this could go on for a long time! John
____________________ Such is life... |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 12:16 pm | 2nd Post |
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So, to continue. Next I fitted a voltmeter to the spare fuse on the standard fuse panel. This is a standard car type 2" analogue voltmeter mounted in a pod and secured to the handlebar with the mounting bracket from a bicycle reflector. Sounds crude, I know, but it looks really neat and works very well  With the voltmeter I was able to verify what the headlight had been trying to tell me. The circuit was charging the battery up to about 1600 ~ 1800 rpm after which it just simply dropped off completely to 11 volts  This is when I resorted to much reading on these forums. And in my Clymer manual, especially the wiring diagrams. To this day I'm still not 100% sure why the voltage would rise up to a certain rev range then suddenly drop off  , but I sure found the problem when I began to delve into the wiring on the bike.It will come as no surprise to anyone who has had similar problems with their GL1200's to hear that I found melted connectors and blackened terminals. In the next installment I'll outline the re-wiring I undertook for anyone who is facing up to the same thing. John
____________________ Such is life... |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 01:08 pm | 3rd Post |
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For anyone who's still with me, here's what I did to fix this. From my exploratory search through the charging loom I found that the three yellow alternator wires passed through four (4) pairs of connectors before they arrived at the rectifier. Separating these connectors revealed melted plastic and blackened terminals. It appeared that I had exposed the culprit. However, after doing my research, I decided to "do the job properly".What followed next was an intensive weekend of carefully fitting a new section of wiring loom. First I checked out the strange looking shrink wrapped device which was fitted into the circuit in between two partially melted connectors. It turned out to be a pair of capacitors, both blown out. I decided that since they were blown anyway, they couldn't be doing too much, so removed them first. Next step was to try to identify a component next to the rectifier/regulator and wired between that and the alternator. I suspected that it was a radio noise suppressor and this was verified via a post to this site. (Thanks again to those who replied to my questions). Again I decided that I didn't care too much about radio noise when my main concern was solving a basic reliability issue. So, the radio noise suppressor followed the blown capacitors into the bin  After having performed the yellow stator wire checks and confirming that the stator was fine, I next pulled out the side cutters and cut the remaining plug pair (beside the battery) out of the loom, one wire at a time. Finally I hard wired the yellow wires directly to the rectifier. Then I cut away the remaining wires at the connector pair at the regulator. The two red/white wires were then connected together and joined to a new 6mm wire directly to the battery positive post. This ensured that the AC current from the alternator was taking the path of least resistance to the rectifier. And the DC current from the regulator is now taking the path of least resistance to the battery. This left the two dark green wires and the black/green wire to deal with. I joined the two dark green wires together and into two new extensions, kind of like a four way thing. I ran one of the new wires directly to the battery negative post and the other to the chassis of the bike. This established a firm connection from the regulator output to the battery, and provided a fresh connection between the battery negative and the chassis (covering both bases, possibly redundant but for the sake of one wire, what the heck!). Finally, to complete the repair work, I hardwired the black/green wire to the pair of black/green wires on the other side of the standard plug re-establishing the connection with the original wiring loom. The next step was to attend to the area around the solenoid. This was a little messy, and had been attacked previously. I cut away the corruption and soldered in new wiring from the solenoid positive live post into the wiring loom bypassing the fuse and re-joining the standard red and red/white wires via a new 30A fuse in an inline fuse holder. This solved the charging problems previously mentioned, and a test ride confirmed that the battery now quickly reaches around 14.5 volts (or so) and maintains that rate of charge at anything much over an idle. I have yet to go for a long ride as I had other things I wanted to tidy up while I was at it. I'll be finished soon and am looking forward to enjoying this bike. In the next installment, I'll outline the last wiring changes I've made, and will post a wiring diagram (of sorts, I'm no auto sparks and my diagram is a bit primitive, but if it helps just one other person it was worth it). John
____________________ Such is life... |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 01:36 pm | 4th Post |
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And finally... The last step was mainly to avoid future problems and to try to anticipate our touring needs. This involved running a new live wire from the starter solenoid live feed through a 30A inline fuse to a 100A solid state relay which I mounted next to the battery. The other side of this was run to a new 6 fuse panel mounted under the false tank where the original radio noise suppressor had been removed. The switched power for this relay was taken from the accessory fuse on the original fuse box to provide power to the relay (and thus to the new fuse panel) only when the ignition is switched on. The voltmeter was then wired to the new fuse panel via a 5A fuse. I took the decision to run a new wire pair from the new fuse panel to the live side of the coils (black/white wires) through a 20A fuse. The Honda loom wires were simply unplugged and will be covered up with heat shrink and tucked out of harms way. (If my new loom proves to be unreliable I can choose to either plug the standard wires back in or investigate my own wiring loom, but I doubt if the new loom will give trouble, it's so simple, and simple is usually more reliable in my experience). Two of the remaining fuse positions are earmarked for a new trailer wiring loom. This I purchased locally from a car trailer accessory shop. It is designed to use the signals from the standard brake/lights/indicators circuit and power the trailer lights via those signals directly from the battery. The second fuse is to power a spare wire in the trailer loom for an accessory plug inside the trailer for charging camera batteries etc. while away on tour. I chose to do this to remove any potential overload from the Honda circuit (trying to keep it simple). I haven't fitted this part yet, that's the next job on the list (this weekend). Then I can button it all up and go for a ride at last  I'll leave you now. Thanks for sticking with me and I hope this has been of help. Regards and best wishes, John Attachment: 1986 GL1200 Aspencade - Wiring Modifications.pdf (Downloaded 283 times)
____________________ Such is life... |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 02:24 pm | 5th Post |
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johnc, Pretty outstanding posts. Very intricate detail. We too just purchased an '84 Aspencade with 35K on it. Everything works well. My yellow trio of wires from the stator were fine and had even had an original type plug re-installed. You could see the solder/heat shrink sections where the joints were done. I eliminated the plug like everyone on this net suggested and soldered everything direct. I had good charging before and have good charging now. The bike runs fine with a small exception of some slight hesitation on cold application. Once it's warmed up to operating temperature, it's pretty well perfect. It seems to have just a little hard starting when it's warm though. I've read here that, that could be caused by starter age. I really don't want to attack that but I figure some day I might have too. Anyway, great post and very informative. Nice job. Scott
____________________ Scott & Karla RETIRED! |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 05:08 pm | 6th Post |
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well done john, you have been busy, hope you manage to get out and ride it.
____________________ GØSVH radio hams do it all night !!! and sometimes with frequency '88 GL1500 |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 07:40 pm | 7th Post |
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Are you sure you're in Australia? You never once mentioned a crocodile or dingo getting a hold of your Goldwing!
____________________ cagers on cell phones scare me I owe my life to a Stebel Nautilus |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 09:52 pm | 8th Post |
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Hi John, that's a great thread. I'll move this to the reference forum as it will be very useful to many members.
____________________ Steve Saunders, Founder Member & Admin. |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 11:01 pm | 9th Post |
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thanks for such great information mate and congratiulatinons on your new wing.. welcome to the family
____________________ 85' GL 1200 Interstate - 40 MPG@75mph |
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10th, 2008 11:17 pm | 10th Post |
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Good job John, keep use updated on how things are going for you and enjoy the ride.
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21st, 2008 12:41 pm | 11th Post |
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Hi there everyone, I nearly forgot to add the most important part to this tale. The test ride! It's winter down here and getting a reasonable day to try things has been a waiting game. We took the bike for a 130 km test and I'm happy to report that the charging system was charging like a champ (14.5V steady [approx] at road speed).By the way, I fitted the trailer wiring loom and that works fine too. All's well that ends well... All the best, John C
____________________ Such is life... |
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| Posted: Fri Nov 7th, 2008 02:06 pm | 12th Post |
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Hi Everyone, As a follow up to this story, we recently took this Goldwing on a tour to Central Australia from Victoria. We covered 6500 kms two-up and towing a trailer with camping gear. The electrical system remains trouble free and we got a good start at all times. I can honestly say that this is the best bike I've ridden (so far...) and it did everything asked of it. In fact considering it's 22 years old and taking into account the remote area we traveled into, it did an amazing job! Our only niggling problems for the trip were the need to remove a spacer from the front fork springs (a corrugated road surface and tight front end was making my vision blur which caused a headache, solved by "softening" the new progressive springs a little), and some warm to hot coolant temps during the hot part of the day when towing. This was controlled by wandering along at steady speeds. Next time we won't be taking so much gear, no camping, just cabins or motels  .I almost forgot, the speedo drive gearbox stripped a gear about 1000 kms from home, but that's the way the cookie crumbles I guess. The trip itself was fantastic. The scenery was breathtaking at times, wide, vast and open, and with almost no sign of civilization for much of the outback section of the trip we were left in awe at the sheer size of it all. Our native wildlife was spectacular, especially the magnificent Wedge Tailed Eagle which was present in plentiful numbers along the main road. The cameras got a good workout, and we arrived home feeling that we had completed a "trip of a lifetime". On our Goldwing! Fantastic!! So to anyone struggling with your wiring issues, keep at it . The reward is more than worth the effort.All the best, and safe riding. John Last edited on Thu Dec 18th, 2008 09:29 am by johnc ____________________ Such is life... |
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| Posted: Fri Nov 7th, 2008 02:26 pm | 13th Post |
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thanks for the fallow up .sounds like you`ve got it whipped. now to enjoy it , when you can----
____________________ 1979 gl1000 dressed --back to naked 1980 gl1100 interstate --side lined 1983 gl1100 interstate the fastest color--RED retired trucker---going to see it again ----on 2 wheels---love it--love it http://serrasj.com/ gwrra 003663 |
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| Posted: Sun Dec 7th, 2008 10:44 pm | 14th Post |
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Good Work Will Done John
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| Posted: Sun Dec 7th, 2008 11:38 pm | 15th Post |
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Hi John, nice to see that you got everything done right. Yes you were saying that it's winter there, but it's winter here too, now at -19 C. I can't go riding for a few months now. I was going to suggest that if you are running the original lights on the bike, you might want to look into the LED lights as they only take 33% draw compared to the old ones. Also I hope you checked the spline gear on your rear wheel too. So keep the rubber down and the shiney side up and enjoy safely. 
____________________ Old Hawkeye. 85 Aspy since New GWRRA Chpt."Y"ON |
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| Posted: Mon Mar 16th, 2009 04:55 pm | 16th Post |
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johnc wrote: And finally... John do you think this will work on the 1982 GL 1100? I have problems with the 3 yellow wire plug melting and red wire melting going into a little box on the right side of the battery
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17th, 2009 07:29 am | 17th Post |
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Ken M, I'm not familiar with the GL1100. The principle of using a relay to switch a load is common practice in automotive wiring so it will work to redirect a load where required. It won't help you with your 3 yellow wires from the stator as this is a direct AC feed to the voltage regulator. It sounds as though there may be a fair bit of resistance somewhere further downstream from the 3 wire connector which is causing the wires to heat up along their entire length, or it may simply be that there is a high current draw forcing the stator to work hard. Do you have many electrical accessories on your bike? If not, try following the 3 yellow wires past the connector near the battery and check any other connectors for corrosion or melting. Ideally you are looking for as little resistance as possible to allow the best current flow into your voltage regulator. The red wire you spoke of sounds like it may be one of the live wires from the battery to feed the main wiring loom on the bike. Again, if your current load is high, from many electrical devices for example, you would benefit from running the new circuit I used which will simply relieve the load on the original circuit and provide a new fuse protected circuit from the battery to the circuit you need to run. This will not relieve the load on the stator in the event of high current loads. I hope this helps. Regards, John C
____________________ Such is life... |
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| Posted: Wed Mar 18th, 2009 06:15 pm | 18th Post |
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thanks a million
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19th, 2009 02:42 am | 19th Post |
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Hey John, Question about your re-wiring, the section where you added the 100A relay, is that part of the relay necessary? Or can the other mods be done alone? Thanks for the great post and info. Kevin
____________________ Kevin 1982 Aspencade That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.Declaration of Independence Belhaven #509 AF&AM 2B1 ASK1 Current Bike 1982 GL1100A 1983 Honda Nighthawk 450 1980 CB750 Custom 1999 V-Star 1100 Custom 1985 Honda GL1200 LTD 1992 Kawasaki Vulcan 1500 |
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19th, 2009 04:43 am | 20th Post |
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Hi Kevin, The straight answer is that you could make the changes I made without the relay. The implications of this are that your accessories added downstream of the battery will be constantly live unless each individual circuit is switched, including the coils (probably not the best solution). I chose to use the solid state relay for its lack of moving/mechanical parts so (hopefully) ensuring longevity and reliability - the main aim of this exercise in the first instance! So, I guess what I'm really saying is that while you could do without the relay, for the extra cost it would be a much better proposition to include it to provide the switched option for your new circuits. Regards, John C
____________________ Such is life... |
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