Won't start....... Ahhhh....... GL1500, it is fixed now. Bad Transistor in ECU - Page 3 - Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums

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post #21 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 12:56 PM
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Chris,
Don't tie in to the ECU too early. The ECU needs to know the engine is running or it will turn off the fuel pump. That is a safety feature in the event of an accident so the pump does not continue to pump fuel in case of a fire. So it needs an engine running signal. I noticed the cruise takes a similar signal off the number 6 coil. The ECU has two choices. The tach signal or the #6 coil signal.
I'm just trying to tie both of your problems together if it is possible. What if there was an issue with the #6 signal and you moved something etc. and now have the signal at the cruise but not at the ECU? I wish I knew for sure where the ECU got the engine running signal from. Can anyone say for sure? Is it the #6 coil. (It's at the ECU) Is it the tach signal? (It's also at the ECU) Chris I think you get my drift. Before you dig in to the ECU be sure the ECU has an engine running signal. Without that the ECU says "Engine not running , I won't turn on the pump." I think the reason the bike continuous to run after you take the jumper off is either it siphons or gravity feeds the carbs slowly. Especially if the tank has lots of gas in it.

Edit: Did a little more investigating. If you turn the key ON, the pump should run for a second or two. OFF, then back ON the pump should run for a second or two. OFF..then ON and the pump should run for a second or two. Does it do this? All above is correct but this feature makes sure the bike has fuel to start only.
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post #22 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 01:45 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the information and the comments are duly noted.

The fuel pump doesn't prime (run for a couple of seconds) when switching on the ignition or when repeating this routine, this is why I suspected the wiring in the first instance, and now the ECU itself.

I have already striped down the ECU and removed what I believe to be the faulty transistor. It didn't cost much from Ebay, so if it doesn't work, no problem. On the other hand this could be the answer to the issue!
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post #23 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 03:33 PM
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The 88-89 bikes had the fuel pump relay which cycled the pump on with key on. 90-up bikes the pump is powered only with engine cranking or running.

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post #24 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by redwing52 View Post
snip...
Edit: Did a little more investigating. If you turn the key ON, the pump should run for a second or two. OFF, then back ON the pump should run for a second or two. OFF..then ON and the pump should run for a second or two. Does it do this? All above is correct but this feature makes sure the bike has fuel to start only.

Redwing, I'm pretty sure the fuel pumps after the 88-89 do not run for a couple of seconds after key-on. Then after those years were modified to have a vacuum petcock, that feature was deleted. It is of no use with a vacuum operated petcock in the gas line.

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post #25 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 03:47 PM
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Guess I'm too slow... DriverRider got in ahead of me with that tidbit.

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post #26 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 06:10 PM
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Chris,
Don't tie in to the ECU too early. The ECU needs to know the engine is running or it will turn off the fuel pump. That is a safety feature in the event of an accident so the pump does not continue to pump fuel in case of a fire. So it needs an engine running signal. I noticed the cruise takes a similar signal off the number 6 coil. The ECU has two choices. The tach signal or the #6 coil signal.
I'm just trying to tie both of your problems together if it is possible. What if there was an issue with the #6 signal and you moved something etc. and now have the signal at the cruise but not at the ECU? I wish I knew for sure where the ECU got the engine running signal from. Can anyone say for sure? Is it the #6 coil. (It's at the ECU) Is it the tach signal? (It's also at the ECU) Chris I think you get my drift. Before you dig in to the ECU be sure the ECU has an engine running signal. Without that the ECU says "Engine not running , I won't turn on the pump." I think the reason the bike continuous to run after you take the jumper off is either it siphons or gravity feeds the carbs slowly. Especially if the tank has lots of gas in it.

Edit: Did a little more investigating. If you turn the key ON, the pump should run for a second or two. OFF, then back ON the pump should run for a second or two. OFF..then ON and the pump should run for a second or two. Does it do this? All above is correct but this feature makes sure the bike has fuel to start only.
If the ECU wasn't getting that signal the engine would not run. It doesn't receive that signal anyway, it puts out that signal.

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post #27 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 08:02 PM
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Redwing, I'm pretty sure the fuel pumps after the 88-89 do not run for a couple of seconds after key-on. Then after those years were modified to have a vacuum petcock, that feature was deleted. It is of no use with a vacuum operated petcock in the gas line.
I had a 94SE and a '98SE.

both of them worked exactly the same.

Key ON, pump runs for 2 seconds and stops.

Key OFF, and back ON, it will run for 2 seconds and it will stop.

IF the oil pressure comes up, then the fuel pump will be turned ON until the key is OFF, or the BAS is activated.

Both of those bikes had the vacuum petcock and both worked just like they are supposed to.

I had plenty of experience with the '98. the fuel pump on it went bad, and I did a lot of testing for flow trying to figure out if it is the pump, or something else.

Jumper the fuel pump B+ terminal to 12V and the fuel pump will run forever. But, if it is OEM hookup, it will only run for 2 seconds key ON unless the engine starts and oil pressure comes up.
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post #28 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 08:44 PM
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I had a 94SE and a '98SE.

both of them worked exactly the same.

Key ON, pump runs for 2 seconds and stops.

Key OFF, and back ON, it will run for 2 seconds and it will stop.

IF the oil pressure comes up, then the fuel pump will be turned ON until the key is OFF, or the BAS is activated.

Both of those bikes had the vacuum petcock and both worked just like they are supposed to.

I had plenty of experience with the '98. the fuel pump on it went bad, and I did a lot of testing for flow trying to figure out if it is the pump, or something else.

Jumper the fuel pump B+ terminal to 12V and the fuel pump will run forever. But, if it is OEM hookup, it will only run for 2 seconds key ON unless the engine starts and oil pressure comes up.
So the engine running signal is oil pressure? I kind of look at the schematic and did not see that but I don't doubt what you say. My old Vega worked like that. When the bearing wore out and oil pressure dropped it would die at a stop sign when the engine would idle and the oil light came on. Good to know and Dave, I learned another thing.
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post #29 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-03-2015, 09:30 PM
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Quote:
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I had a 94SE and a '98SE.both of them worked exactly the same.Key ON, pump runs for 2 seconds and stops.Key OFF, and back ON, it will run for 2 seconds and it will stop.IF the oil pressure comes up, then the fuel pump will be turned ON until the key is OFF, or the BAS is activated.Both of those bikes had the vacuum petcock and both worked just like they are supposed to.I had plenty of experience with the '98. the fuel pump on it went bad, and I did a lot of testing for flow trying to figure out if it is the pump, or something else.Jumper the fuel pump B+ terminal to 12V and the fuel pump will run forever. But, if it is OEM hookup, it will only run for 2 seconds key ON unless the engine starts and oil pressure comes up.
I can assure you oil pressure has nothing to do with fuel pump running parameters as there is no oil pressure signal wire to ECU and fuel pump battery (+) supply comes directly from ECU.

J.D.

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post #30 of 46 (permalink) Old 07-04-2015, 12:09 AM
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Well I wish someone would make up there mind! How about the vacuum signal? That is there.
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