Sidecar brakes - Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums

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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 08:59 AM Thread Starter
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As a lot of you know I bought a Hitchhiker sidecar to go on Old Ghost. It's not mounted yet as I need a mount part re-worked or fabbed.

This sidecar has drum brakes on it and normally connects to the bike by way of a quick disconnect setup. The 1200 it came off of was setup with a "T" spliced into the hard line going to the front slaved caliper of the linked system.

So here's my thoughts on the hookup. I do have the quick disconnect end removed from the "T" off that 1200 and was thinking since I don't have a linked system a "T" wouldn't really be needed if I replaced the rear master cylinder on my 82 with one off an 83. Since the 83 master cylinder already has 2 outlets for the brake lines going to the calipers then I wouldn't need to plumb in a "T" for the quick disconnect.

Anyone got an 83 rear master cylinder they don't need? With the hoses? Might want the reservoir too if it's larger than the one on my 82 and will hold more fluid.

What's your thoughts on this guys?

Michael
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 09:23 AM
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My sidecar brakes work off the front brakes of the bike. They put a banjo fitting into the master cylinder and ran it over to the side car. I also have a quick disconnect were the side car frame mounts the to the side car mounts on the bike.


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To my beloved wife Carol, may she R.I.P 6-3-2012 @ 7:35 pm
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Miles of 1-13-16
1977 GL1000 Nekkid Wing - 19,1000
1979 GL1000 Nekkid Wing - 58,180
1982 GL1100 Interstate - 100,000
1982 GL1100 Aspy (parts bike) - 61,522
1985 V45 Magna - 50,985
1986 GL1200 Aspy with Champion Escort II Sidecar - 128,911 (odometer broke in 9-12. around 180,000)
2003 GL1800 10,000

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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 09:41 AM Thread Starter
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Got some pics of that setup Brain?

The reason I'm thinking of going with it hooked into the rear is that I use the rear brakes a lot more than the fronts in slow turns and at slow speed, keeps the bike more stable. Also this way the hoses would be as short as possible and mostly out of sight.

Michael
Too much chrome to polish, too little time!!
Have trailer, will travel!! Not all Wingers are old Wingers.

PGR member. Riding in memory of my father, Clyde D. Ward, USN. WWII

Myself, USN, Vietnam Vet. 68-72, 74-76
VF-194 aboard the USS. Oriskany
USS Saratoga, ships company

-----------------------------------
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 10:28 AM
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Michael, I think I would go with your idea. I also use the rear brake for better control in slow speed turns.

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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 01:36 PM
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AZgl1500 wrote:
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Michael, I think I would go with your idea. I also use the rear brake for better control in slow speed turns.
Actually that is wrong. Since the front brake of the bike does the most stopping, you want the side car to stop as quickly as the bike especially at higher speeds. If the car does not stop as fast as the bike, the higher the speeds the more it will push hard to the left and possibly into oncoming traffic. Heres some pic's of how the brakes are connected to the front master cylinder and the quick disconnect nounted on the lower left enginge gaurd. The steel braided line is the one going to the side car.


































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To my beloved wife Carol, may she R.I.P 6-3-2012 @ 7:35 pm
You will forever be on my finger and forever in my heart.

Miles of 1-13-16
1977 GL1000 Nekkid Wing - 19,1000
1979 GL1000 Nekkid Wing - 58,180
1982 GL1100 Interstate - 100,000
1982 GL1100 Aspy (parts bike) - 61,522
1985 V45 Magna - 50,985
1986 GL1200 Aspy with Champion Escort II Sidecar - 128,911 (odometer broke in 9-12. around 180,000)
2003 GL1800 10,000

Two Wheels Down, Shiny Side Up
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 01:51 PM
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Bagmaster wrote:
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Got some pics of that setup Brain?

The reason I'm thinking of going with it hooked into the rear is that I use the rear brakes a lot more than the fronts in slow turns and at slow speed, keeps the bike more stable. Also this way the hoses would be as short as possible and mostly out of sight.
Micheal,



What ever you learned about two wheel riding...forget it when it comes to riding with a side car. Stability is not a problem with a side car. Except in turns. When turning a side car rig, you literally have to "drive" around the car in a righ turn, and in a left turn you have to drag the car through the corner. My best advice to you is after you get it connected, leave it like that till you become profecient in "hacking". Practice, practice, practice doing figure eights in a vacant parking lot going faster and faster and faster while getting tighter, tighter, and tighter till you make the side car "fly". Also remember, when you followed me from Llano, I was doing the "seat dance" to counter balance in corners. It is best to NEVER ride with an empty side car. The side car is suppose to be 1/3 the weight of the bike. If not, ballast the side car to equal the load.


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To my beloved wife Carol, may she R.I.P 6-3-2012 @ 7:35 pm
You will forever be on my finger and forever in my heart.

Miles of 1-13-16
1977 GL1000 Nekkid Wing - 19,1000
1979 GL1000 Nekkid Wing - 58,180
1982 GL1100 Interstate - 100,000
1982 GL1100 Aspy (parts bike) - 61,522
1985 V45 Magna - 50,985
1986 GL1200 Aspy with Champion Escort II Sidecar - 128,911 (odometer broke in 9-12. around 180,000)
2003 GL1800 10,000

Two Wheels Down, Shiny Side Up
GWRRA Member Region H, Tx/Chapter P
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 05:19 PM
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Hey Michael



My sidecar brakes are connected to my rear master on my '81. On the mule, my front brake lever operatesboth calipers of the front brake, and the rear pedal operates the rear brake plus sidecar brake. The pedal does not operate any of the front steerwheel calipers.My sidecar brake is connected using a double banjo bolt right at the rear master cylinder.The sidecar tireskids now and then when I use the rear brake alone, with the tub unloaded. I like my set up because I can control front wheel brake pressure in order to control front wheel skid on slick conditions, and Istill can apply both my non-steering brakes.



Folks set up the sidecar brakenumerous ways, operating with the front or rear, and sometimes with it's own pedal. It's a horse a'piece.

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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 05:52 PM Thread Starter
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82gl1100iwingman wrote:
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Bagmaster wrote:
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Got some pics of that setup Brain?

The reason I'm thinking of going with it hooked into the rear is that I use the rear brakes a lot more than the fronts in slow turns and at slow speed, keeps the bike more stable. Also this way the hoses would be as short as possible and mostly out of sight.
Micheal,



What ever you learned about two wheel riding...forget it when it comes to riding with a side car. Stability is not a problem with a side car. Except in turns. When turning a side car rig, you literally have to "drive" around the car in a righ turn, and in a left turn you have to drag the car through the corner. My best advice to you is after you get it connected, leave it like that till you become profecient in "hacking". Practice, practice, practice doing figure eights in a vacant parking lot going faster and faster and faster while getting tighter, tighter, and tighter till you make the side car "fly". Also remember, when you followed me from Llano, I was doing the "seat dance" to counter balance in corners. It is best to NEVER ride with an empty side car. The side car is suppose to be 1/3 the weight of the bike. If not, ballast the side car to equal the load.
Yea, been doing a lot of reading on how to drive a hacked rig. Will have to unlearn a few things.

I plan on at least 3 solid weeks of practice before going on the highway with it.

I use all brakes in panic stops, straight line stops, but always start with the rear brakes first. I got a lead the other day from a Harley hack owner for a good hack brake man.

Yea, that day leaving Llano was a bear with all the crosswinds.

AS for as ballast, I intend to install a battery box to the inside rail for a good car battery and maybe also an aux gas tank. Tool bag and some other things will go in the HitchHiker's trunk.

I also intend to take the first spring classes I can sign up for the sidecar classes given in North Carolina. That's the nearest location to me.

I've already found an isolator that allows you to run the bike battery and car battery at the same time without stressing the charging system.

http://www.yandina.com/c100InfoR3.htm



Michael
Too much chrome to polish, too little time!!
Have trailer, will travel!! Not all Wingers are old Wingers.

PGR member. Riding in memory of my father, Clyde D. Ward, USN. WWII

Myself, USN, Vietnam Vet. 68-72, 74-76
VF-194 aboard the USS. Oriskany
USS Saratoga, ships company

-----------------------------------
Bagmaster, our former forum Toolmaster and friend, is no longer with us. He passed away in February 2012.

The roads and byways, no matter how beautiful and exhilarating, are a lonelier place now. RIP Bagmaster (Baggy).
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-30-2009, 11:00 AM Thread Starter
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speaking of charging systems, mine acted weird for a few minutes on a ride yesterday. Got some real loud static in the headsets that wasn't there before and the volt meter started dropping like a rock down to 10 volts. Shut the bike down, checked main fuse and stator connector, all fine.

Restarted bike and everything went back to normal for the rest of the trip.






Michael
Too much chrome to polish, too little time!!
Have trailer, will travel!! Not all Wingers are old Wingers.

PGR member. Riding in memory of my father, Clyde D. Ward, USN. WWII

Myself, USN, Vietnam Vet. 68-72, 74-76
VF-194 aboard the USS. Oriskany
USS Saratoga, ships company

-----------------------------------
Bagmaster, our former forum Toolmaster and friend, is no longer with us. He passed away in February 2012.

The roads and byways, no matter how beautiful and exhilarating, are a lonelier place now. RIP Bagmaster (Baggy).
-----------------------------------
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 11-30-2009, 03:43 PM
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FYI the 83 rear master cylinder only has one line outlet . It splits to the front at the pressure regulator .



My concern in this set up is the fact that drum brakes require more fluid to operate . I have to question if the stock bike master can supply the volume of fluid to operate a drum brake wheel cylinder . Just makes me wonder .

Mike
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