Wet roads - Page 3 - Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums

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post #21 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-17-2016, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by CaptainMidnight85 View Post
Rubber & Pavement vs. Water ...is a bit closer in this case, isn't it?
For the OP, yes, but not for the one I was quoting. The water is a third element in the friction equation for the original posting. Very much like engine oil keeps metal to metal contact from occurring, water does the same thing and it is called, drum roll please, hydroplaning.

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Originally Posted by AZgl1800 View Post
Yes,

had a little schooling on that myself somewhere.
Large fat tires slide on wet roads easier than normal sized tires with aggressive rain sipes in the tread design.

The smaller tires, have more "weight per square inch" than the big floppy fat tires which hydroplane in a heart beat.

This is why the old VW Bugs did so well in the snow, and Corvettes are tremendously horrible in the same stuff. Weight per square inch is a part of that mathematical equation I spoke of.


This same thing is important to drag racers when they launch. Having the front end lift just far enough off the ground puts all the weight of the vehicle on the rear tires and increases the traction available to gain the all important forward momentum.
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post #22 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-17-2016, 03:07 PM
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The option to correct the adverse conditions of hydroplaning as experienced, if left purely to the scientific method of application, is for him to have a tire that deals with the water (the fluid inclusive to the experienced adversity) dispersed in a more effective manner than that which his current tire affords, to minimize the potential reoccurrence under the same conditions, correct?
That would be logical.
The route of achieving this correction is debatable.
A motorcycle tire designed for better wet conditions is the easy answer, whereas a automobile tire designed for handling wet conditions could be beneficial, or could be subject to weight calculations of the contact patch upon the road surface that may not be necessarily favorable by the Goldwings' rear biased weighting if comparatively measured against an OE automotive installation with regard to potential hydroplaning of a weighted wheel under duplicated conditions.
That data is missing, hence the debatable nature I'm pondering myself.
Experience is key here, as I use to question the ability of a car tire to effectively subvert hydroplaning when used on bike giving less downforce than the car it was designed for.

Clearly, I think too much with things like this, as my simple answer needs to focus on;
E3 is bad in the wet,
A tire for better wet is a better choice for a daily rider
An all-season car tire proves well if the application is available and,
A Gl1000 has very few options, further distancing automotive tires as a option.

At least he has more options.
I've grooved Highway and Interstate roads to deal with here that makes the want of a wider contact patch for better lane control. Anyone riding here draws the same conclusion. Car tires on bikes are extremely popular here for the grooved road equation by itself alone.

I'm all over the map, I know...
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post #23 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-17-2016, 08:52 PM
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soooo, water + painted surfaces = bad???
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post #24 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-17-2016, 08:56 PM
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soooo, water + painted surfaces = bad???

water on Paint = oil slick

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post #25 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-18-2016, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by CaptainMidnight85 View Post
I've grooved Highway and Interstate roads to deal with here that makes the want of a wider contact patch for better lane control. Anyone riding here draws the same conclusion. Car tires on bikes are extremely popular here for the grooved road equation by itself alone.

I'm all over the map, I know...
I will give something else to dwell upon. No matter the tire choice, a grooved/rutted road will always make a 2 wheeled vehicle more susceptible to the wandering or pulling effect that occurs simply because of the lack of stability that four corners provides. I don't believe I have noticed any improvement in that situation with having the Austone mounted.


As a side note, I replaced both tires at the same time almost 3 years ago. It is time to do the front E3 this spring. Meanwhile back at the car tire, it is only about half worn, if that. So, same price, twice the useful life.
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post #26 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-18-2016, 09:12 AM
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I've been seriously thinking of doing something about my rear drive options.
Inclusion of a car tire is just one of the criteria (with a few reasoning's) that I've been thinking of dealing with in changing the rear end.
65+Mph on these grooved roads here can be dangerous. The lines are never perfectly straight for no appreciable amount of distance and their depth is variable, which keeps the bike thinking it's constantly on a slight lean much of the time. Continually compensating is a reality here. Tire choice and air pressure make a difference in my opinion, at least with the highway/interstate roads here in Sioux Falls. It's a front wheel issue more so than a rear wheel issue, aside from the rear wheel traction debate.

I'm half-inclined to put a car tire on the front as well.
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post #27 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-18-2016, 09:27 AM
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I gotta step in here and defend the E3s,I have always used them on my ST1100 and my 1500 and wore all them out without any issue and rain isn't a obstacles for me,never had any of mine slip on wet roads.Now I do think that staying with a tire you like adds trust to riding,you know what it capable of,you know what tire pressure the tire likes for max milage,you know how many miles it will run,you know how far you can push it in turns.
I rode my St1100 from Dallas to Tuscon and it rained all the way and sometimes the speed was way faster than it should be but being comfortable and trust in the E3 I had fun.Got caught in a torrential downfall in Arkansas on the Wing and all the Harley riders were under the bridges but I just rode it out,maybe someday I might have an issue but I will keep the E3.Might just try a CT someday.

Love chasing white lines but they are difficult to catch.Hate drivers with no STOPLIGHTS.

1968 Kawasaki Avenger
1969 H1 Kawasaki
1975 1000
1985 LTD
1982 1100,STANDARD
1991 ST 1100
1991 SE Goldwing.
1995 BMW R 1100RS
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post #28 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-18-2016, 11:52 AM
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I gotta step in here and defend the E3s,I have always used them on my ST1100 and my 1500 and wore all them out without any issue and rain isn't a obstacles for me,never had any of mine slip on wet roads.Now I do think that staying with a tire you like adds trust to riding,you know what it capable of,you know what tire pressure the tire likes for max milage,you know how many miles it will run,you know how far you can push it in turns.
I rode my St1100 from Dallas to Tuscon and it rained all the way and sometimes the speed was way faster than it should be but being comfortable and trust in the E3 I had fun.Got caught in a torrential downfall in Arkansas on the Wing and all the Harley riders were under the bridges but I just rode it out,maybe someday I might have an issue but I will keep the E3.Might just try a CT someday.
Good deal! I never really had a problem with the E3, but, like you, I never rode it in a combination of road conditions, driver inputs, etc that went beyond what it was capable of.
That said, I know my rear PVT can handle more water at a time than the E3 could ever dream of, and that gives me confidence. I find myself riding within the limits of the front tire, because I know it will reach it's limits sooner.

Vote one for year-round riding! Austone Darksider PVT (Passenger Vehicle Tire)

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post #29 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-18-2016, 12:30 PM
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Good deal! I never really had a problem with the E3, but, like you, I never rode it in a combination of road conditions, driver inputs, etc that went beyond what it was capable of.
That said, I know my rear PVT can handle more water at a time than the E3 could ever dream of, and that gives me confidence. I find myself riding within the limits of the front tire, because I know it will reach it's limits sooner.
The more miles a rider accumulates the safer they are going to be in all conditions,rider that haven't had the opertunity to weather all the conditions just won't understand throttle management and braking in certain conditions.When I was way younger and used my wing as my only transportation because wife needed the car I have rode in snow n ice (on my enduro)to get to work using feet as skids.
The only time I had an issue was in Catossa Ok on wet roads on my 75 wing ( serial # 446) and was just cruising along and ran over a tar snake and we went down before quick could get ready,pretty well tore off the fairing and bags but was able to get it home to claremore but being an former mile and half mile flat tracker getting off at highway speeds on wet road was not much of an issue,bike had Michelein tires.
At last count my motorcycle ridden was just past 500,000 miles.

Love chasing white lines but they are difficult to catch.Hate drivers with no STOPLIGHTS.

1968 Kawasaki Avenger
1969 H1 Kawasaki
1975 1000
1985 LTD
1982 1100,STANDARD
1991 ST 1100
1991 SE Goldwing.
1995 BMW R 1100RS
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post #30 of 31 (permalink) Old 02-18-2016, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Pure Texas View Post
The only time I had an issue was in Catoosa Ok on wet roads on my 75 wing ( serial # 446) and was just cruising along and ran over a tar snake and we went down before quick could get ready,pretty well tore off the fairing and bags but was able to get it home to Claremore but being an former mile and half mile flat tracker getting off at highway speeds on wet road was not much of an issue,bike had Michelin tires.
At last count my motorcycle ridden was just past 500,000 miles.

there is just no substitute for old dirt track skills when you only have 1 second to "do something"


even on my 1800, I have had to resurrect old dirt bike riding skills.
  • going around a tight curve met up with loose river sand after a rain
  • going into a twisty too hard and 'marbles all over the road' from a rainstorm
  • choosing to ride out across my yard when the ground was too soft and the rear end wants to go sideways
  • pulled into a parking lot and the front wheel slips on an oil film

managed to keep the rubber down, and the shiny side up in all of those

~ John


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