1990 GL1500 dies in gear - Page 3 - Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums

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post #21 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 02:05 PM
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Does the neutral light go out and the reverse light come on when you shift to reverse?

Mike

Worked on the "big rigs" for 45 years now just riding my Wing whenever I can. Gets cold in Wisconsin.
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post #22 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 02:43 PM
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Year: 1990
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rayjoe View Post
How old is the battery and are the connections tight?
Rayjoe
the battery is new this season, the clock and radio presets all stay, if it was an connection or battery problem the radio memory and clock would be gone and the bike would / should have starting problems and it starts right up cold or hot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dadztoy View Post
2nd post down details adjustment for the GL1500

http://goldwingdocs.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24556
I'll double check this tomorrow but as I have said the cables are snug, the switching into and out of reverse has been smooth, i use reverse all the time.

but i'll go read that stuff possible my answer is in one of thoes articles on that forum, thanks for the link

Quote:
Originally Posted by redwing52 View Post
The only thing I can think of is that the cables change electrically is to ground or un-ground the reverse switch. It does that function and engages the gear.
this switching from ground to unground, is it in the switch by the reverse lever (left side)? I'm betting engaging of the gear is the problem, how do i get to the gearing for reverse?

when trying to engage the reverse when moving the lever the neutral light goes out, at that exact moment the radio mutes, but the "R" light does not come on. the "R" light is working because it lights up when i first turn the key on. Push the reverses lever back down and radio comes back and neutral light comes back on.

I've aske before and it seems like the answer must be NO but does anyone have a repair manual section on the reverse linkages, that are internal near the starter that the reverse lever/cables are engaging so I can learn how that all works? With my mechanical background I'm thinking the problem seems to be related the the fact that the electronics thinks the bike is in reverse.

L8r
Larry
1990 GL 1500 just got her 3/8/16
1986 GL1200A Aspencade, from 6/1/12 to 3/1/2016 have rode over 28,000 miles on her.
1982 KZ 1100 may have put 10000 miles on it in 10 years
Multiple Yamaha XS 750 & XS 850 One had a vetter fairing, bags and trunk
Honda CB400 Drove from Chicago to Tulsa Ok in 1984
Honda CB250 Enduro loved it from street to dirt and back again all the time.
YZ 250 never raced but rode alot, First bike ever was a mini bike with a Brigs engine.
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post #23 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 03:24 PM
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All parts related with reverse is given in the picture below. Service Manual page 18-4.
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post #24 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 04:14 PM
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Dies in Gear

justwingnit wrote:

"The battery is new this season, the clock and radio presets all stay, if it was an connection or battery problem the radio memory and clock would be gone and the bike would / should have starting problems and it starts right up cold or hot."


The reason I asked is because of something I witnessed at the local shop.

A customer brought in a bike that the electronic speedo would act up above 30 mph. They checked the sensor and speedo itself and could not find the problem. Finally one of the techs grabbed the wiring harness on the right side and shook it. The speedo when nuts.

Long story short. The positive cable was just laying on the battery. The owner had disconnected it for some reason and forgot to reconnect it. This bike had been ridden about a 100 miles this way and had been started 20-30 times trying to recreate the problem. If I had not been there and seen it myself I not sure I would have believed it.

Think about it. The starter draws a lot of power to start the bike and the positive cable was just laying on the battery. NO BOLT!!

Sorry about the length of this post. Bad connections can manifest lots of different problems.

Hope you figure it out.

Rayjoe

I've learned so much from my mistakes, I'm thinking about making a few more.
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post #25 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 04:48 PM
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Rayjoe, it is expressed frequently on this forum that loose contacts will cause heat and voltage drop.

Back to your problem,
The ignition is cancelled by ECU/ECM automatically by monitoring the side stand switch and gear shift sensor inputs. So, if it dies when shifting 1st gear the problem should be at the side stand switch or wiring.

Or a stuck clutch. Try shifting when the bike is on the centerstand. If it is a stuck clutch it will probably not die and the rear wheel will turn.

I couldn't find any explanation for the reverse system will cause this problem yet.
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post #26 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 04:50 PM
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Here are the pages from my Electrical Troubleshooting Manual for the 93 model reverse system. Yours should be very similar if not the same.
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File Type: pdf Reverse system.pdf (1.87 MB, 7 views)

Larry

Only two things are infinite... the universe and human stupidity; and I am not sure about the former.
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post #27 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 04:56 PM
I think I was wrong once!
 
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I cant thank all of you on this forum enough every time I've had truble you all come threw with a lot to think about and some times a direct "hay i had that happen to me"

after dadztoys gave me the link to the other page, i have been over there reading and reading, and downloading.

At this time I can officially say I'm baffled and have no clue where I'm going to look / test next.

RECAP PROBLEM...
Bike engine shuts off like turning kill switch when shifting out of neutral! At the exact moment the engine dies the radio will mute. Pull shiftier back into neutral the radio comes back off mute and you can restart engine. Try to put it into reverse the neutral light goes out but the "R" light does not come on and it has no response to pressing start button. Side stand switch is unplugged and jumped (as a test) at the bike side of plug green / green whit.

I have years experience with automotive and motorcycle schematic reading so I pray I dont get a headache and can figure this out.

Bellboy40 I plan to go threw that diagram and the bike to marrow hopefully i find something that makes scene.
Erdeniz Umman I agree this is why it is by passed and on center stand or not same problem


L8r
Larry
1990 GL 1500 just got her 3/8/16
1986 GL1200A Aspencade, from 6/1/12 to 3/1/2016 have rode over 28,000 miles on her.
1982 KZ 1100 may have put 10000 miles on it in 10 years
Multiple Yamaha XS 750 & XS 850 One had a vetter fairing, bags and trunk
Honda CB400 Drove from Chicago to Tulsa Ok in 1984
Honda CB250 Enduro loved it from street to dirt and back again all the time.
YZ 250 never raced but rode alot, First bike ever was a mini bike with a Brigs engine.
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post #28 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 04:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justwingnit View Post
the battery is new this season, the clock and radio presets all stay, if it was an connection or battery problem the radio memory and clock would be gone and the bike would / should have starting problems and it starts right up cold or hot.



I'll double check this tomorrow but as I have said the cables are snug, the switching into and out of reverse has been smooth, i use reverse all the time.

but i'll go read that stuff possible my answer is in one of thoes articles on that forum, thanks for the link



this switching from ground to unground, is it in the switch by the reverse lever (left side)? I'm betting engaging of the gear is the problem, how do i get to the gearing for reverse?

when trying to engage the reverse when moving the lever the neutral light goes out, at that exact moment the radio mutes, but the "R" light does not come on. the "R" light is working because it lights up when i first turn the key on. Push the reverses lever back down and radio comes back and neutral light comes back on.

I've aske before and it seems like the answer must be NO but does anyone have a repair manual section on the reverse linkages, that are internal near the starter that the reverse lever/cables are engaging so I can learn how that all works? With my mechanical background I'm thinking the problem seems to be related the the fact that the electronics thinks the bike is in reverse.
Larry,
The sophistication of the start reverse system will blow your mind. I took 2 years of electricity and 1 year of electronics but every time there is an issue I have to "plow" through the diagram again and again. I will post it for you but good luck if you don't have pretty good experience. Here you go.
No the reverse switch I was referring to is not at the lever. The one I was referring to is by the dipstick. See attached.
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File Type: jpg Untitled.jpg (133.1 KB, 16 views)
File Type: jpg Untitledz.jpg (87.7 KB, 13 views)

Mike

Worked on the "big rigs" for 45 years now just riding my Wing whenever I can. Gets cold in Wisconsin.
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post #29 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 05:18 PM
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Mike, I agree 100% that the reverse system is a very complicated system and hard to understand all its functions. The pdf files I sent have a description of how the reverse system works as well as some simplified wiring diagrams to help follow along as you read how it works. It seems to be more complicated than necessary but I guess the lawyers had a big say in how it was designed to help prevent some lawsuits.
I also worked in the electronics field for over 30 years and with about 9 months of electronic training in the Air Force and several more months of electronic training in my job at the telephone company. Those Honda wiring diagrams for the 1500 are still hard to read.
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Larry

Only two things are infinite... the universe and human stupidity; and I am not sure about the former.
-- Albert Einstein

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post #30 of 61 (permalink) Old 07-24-2016, 05:24 PM
I think I was wrong once!
 
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Year: 1990
Make: GL1500
Model: 1990 GL 1500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bellboy40 View Post
Mike, I agree 100% that the reverse system is a very complicated system and hard to understand all its functions. The pdf files I sent have a description of how the reverse system works as well as some simplified wiring diagrams to help follow along as you read how it works. It seems to be more complicated than necessary but I guess the lawyers had a big say in how it was designed to help prevent some lawsuits.
I also worked in the electronics field for over 30 years and with about 9 months of electronic training in the Air Force and several more months in my job at the telephone company. Those Honda wiring diagrams for the 1500 are still hard to read.
do you think the engine shutting off and radio muting is related to a reverse problem?

L8r
Larry
1990 GL 1500 just got her 3/8/16
1986 GL1200A Aspencade, from 6/1/12 to 3/1/2016 have rode over 28,000 miles on her.
1982 KZ 1100 may have put 10000 miles on it in 10 years
Multiple Yamaha XS 750 & XS 850 One had a vetter fairing, bags and trunk
Honda CB400 Drove from Chicago to Tulsa Ok in 1984
Honda CB250 Enduro loved it from street to dirt and back again all the time.
YZ 250 never raced but rode alot, First bike ever was a mini bike with a Brigs engine.
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