1997 Goldwing GL1500 Jerks under 2,000 RPM - Page 12 - Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums

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post #111 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-22-2018, 02:02 PM Thread Starter
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High all!


I'm back again! I have a question or clarification of the three different spark plugs listed in the manual. Right now, the bike is running about 95% percent better than before but with an occassional jerk or two during low RPM acceleration in 3rd to OD under 2,000 RPM. It doesn't do it consistently as it has done prior to replacing the plugs, but it did it once this morning not long after starting the bike after a 40 minute drive. After the short event, the bike ran normal. Seems to me my carbs need tuning, or I may need to yank off the carbs and set the floats to 8mm instead of 7mm, but I'll do that next month when I purchase the new wires.


The manual lists 3 different plugs:


1. Standard - DPR7EA-9
2. Gold Climate - DPR6EA-9
3. High Speed long term riding - DPR8EA-9


Right now I'm using the Standard which seems to be working fine. The difference between the three with regards to PN is the fourth digit (6, 7, and 8). Correct me if I'm wrong, but are 6EA plugs the strongest? Or is it the other way around. Given that 6EA plugs are for colder climates below 41F degrees, I assume that means the spark is stronger than the weakest plug 8EA-9. I'm wondering why a weaker plug would yield better high RPM results? Does this have to do with spark-knock control?



Right now, temperatures in my area during the summer have been averaging 99F degrees with a heat index of 109. So the standard plugs would be the best option of course. However, what were to happen if I installed the cold temperature plugs (6EA-9)? Would the engine spark knock?


Looking at the old plugs, most were correct. However, there were two plugs that were the high RPM plugs (I assume weaker ones if I understand correctly) which were PN: DPR8EA-9. I think those two plugs were the ones misfiring at low RPM.


Summary:


Are the 8EA-9 plugs weaker than the 6EA-9 plugs?
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post #112 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-22-2018, 09:18 PM
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The spark strength is not effected by the heat range of the plug. That only controls how well the heat is transferred from the ceramic to the metal portion of the plug. If the plug gets too hot, it can cause pre-ignition, and it can damage the internal resistor, if it is a resistor plug, which those are. So you select the heat range so that the plug operates at the correct temperature. Cold weather causes the plug to cool off a little too well, so changing to a plug that doesn't transfer heat as well, puts the plug temp back in spec. Conversely, running at extended high speeds tends to overheat the plug, so selecting one that can move that heat into the head better will keep the business end of the plug from getting too hot.

Put the stock plugs in, run them a while then pull them out and look at them to see how things are running. Who knows why you had a mix of plugs. Might have been what was on hand, or was done for a reason, like you can run a hotter plug on a cyl. with high oil consumption to help keep the plug from fouling as often. Not a fix but more of a band-aid. No idea why you would have two cyl. with colder plugs, at least not on a water cooled engine.
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post #113 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-22-2018, 09:51 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RambozoClown View Post
The spark strength is not effected by the heat range of the plug. That only controls how well the heat is transferred from the ceramic to the metal portion of the plug. If the plug gets too hot, it can cause pre-ignition, and it can damage the internal resistor, if it is a resistor plug, which those are. So you select the heat range so that the plug operates at the correct temperature. Cold weather causes the plug to cool off a little too well, so changing to a plug that doesn't transfer heat as well, puts the plug temp back in spec. Conversely, running at extended high speeds tends to overheat the plug, so selecting one that can move that heat into the head better will keep the business end of the plug from getting too hot.

Put the stock plugs in, run them a while then pull them out and look at them to see how things are running. Who knows why you had a mix of plugs. Might have been what was on hand, or was done for a reason, like you can run a hotter plug on a cyl. with high oil consumption to help keep the plug from fouling as often. Not a fix but more of a band-aid. No idea why you would have two cyl. with colder plugs, at least not on a water cooled engine.

My best guess as to why two of the plugs were the wrong ones (high RPM plugs) was the previous owner. He isn't the brightest when it comes to proper maintenance of anything....lol Tractors, trucks, cars, and bikes; if it's a machine, it will likely be neglected. Just today I told him that it was important to change the nickel plated plugs earlier than normal, roughly 30,000 miles give or take. I'm told that these plugs are not known for lasting very long. He laughed and said, "Not my Goldwing! I can go forever on those plugs and mine doesn't have nickel plated plugs". I'm like, "huh? Are you sure? Could that be the reason why your bike doesn't start very well and tends to stall whether cold or hot?" LOL He's the one that sold me my Goldwing because he couldn't figure out why it wouldn't run right. So he sold it to me and purchased another one....a 1998 Goldwing A. It smokes (blue) bad when starting up and runs like hell. Once it warms up, it runs better, but after shutdown and restart, it spits, pugs, and sounds ragged, but he thinks everything is fine. LOL



My wife's Dodge RAM peace of crap Hemi just went through that. It misfired bad on two cylinders and I thought it might have been the typical Hemi valve seat failure. Turns out the nickel plated plugs have to be replaced every 30,000 miles according to Dodge specs; at least that was what I was told by the service department. What is the recommended plug replacement frequency of the Goldwing?


Right now I'm running the correct spark plugs on all cylinders, NKG DPR7EA-9 standard plugs, and she runs fairly well. Some of my issues involves tuning and syncing the carbs, and also resetting the floats in the carbs to 8mm instead of the 7mm I mistakenly set them at last year. I will do all of this next month when I have all available parts, i.e. factory muffler with baffles, new plugs wires, yank the carbs for another rebuild and resetting of the floats to 8mm, and then I'll perform a proper idle/air mixture adjustment and carb-sync. Should be perfect by then. I suspect also that the idiotic free-flowing sawed exhaust (sawed as in jury-rigged) may be contributing to engine performance issues. As a test run, I removed the chrome jury-rigged caps the previous owner installed on the mufflers, and I wrapped it with baffle wrap (fiber glass) and re-installed the chrome end-caps; I hate those ugly things and it makes the Goldwing sound hideous with that absurdly loud over-toned bass humming. I noticed improvement to engine performance on the low-end since a little more back-pressure is supplied to the exhaust system. I know from experience that modern machines must have some form of back-pressure which helps improve fuel efficiency, helps keep the exhaust valves a little cleaner, and reduces exhaust flow turbulence. It reduced the over tone about 10% percent but still annoying. I cannot wait to get the factory mufflers....this jury-rigged crap is driving me insane. Ear drums want to vibrate out of my head.
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post #114 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-22-2018, 10:54 PM
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The Honda Service Manual states plug replacement at 12.5K mile intervals.

These are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph.
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post #115 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-22-2018, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluewaterhooker0 View Post
The Honda Service Manual states plug replacement at 12.5K mile intervals.
That's better than the recommended 4K miles for the four bangers.

Advise given here is free and comes with no warranty "Caveat emptor"

Ken.
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post #116 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-22-2018, 11:26 PM
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I've been following this thread and doing the suggest repairs/replacements. Temp sensor in the water pipe. Checking all vac. lines for proper connections. It's been weeks since the carb was off so I can't remember seeing the bent or kinked vacuum lines. Gad, I hate to pull that off again. I have not checked the plugs, but will tonight. The bike has been setting for 6 yrs. Carbs rebuilt, lots of little things repaired and replaced throughout the systems. It runs much better than a few month back but now has this surge at low throttle, as the core of this thread is focused on. Here's a video I shot tonight of the bike fully warmed up, throttle set to 2k rpms and held. No choke. Really frustrating to say the least.

Thanks for the help on this.

Robert & Lisa Trim

2006 GW Navi (Mine/ours)
1997 Asplencade 1500 (for sale)
2004 Yamaha VStar 650 (hers)
1984 Honda 250 Elite scooter, restored (hers)
International 4800 DTE pulling a 36' toy hauler for the above toys.
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post #117 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-23-2018, 12:52 AM
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You guys are making me feel guilty. I've got better than 40K miles on the plugs in my 1500. Fuel economy is still at 37 mpg or better and the engine runs great. By the way, there is 173000 miles on the bike. Guess I should change those plugs soon.

1998 - GL1500 w/175,000 miles
2003 - GL1800 w/106,000 miles
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post #118 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-23-2018, 02:03 AM
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Trimsters, you need to start your own thread if you want help with your bike's issues.

Why ain't we ridin'?
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post #119 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-23-2018, 06:54 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluewaterhooker0 View Post
The Honda Service Manual states plug replacement at 12.5K mile intervals.

Really? Wow! That is very often. So basically over 10,000 miles and it's new plugs?
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post #120 of 150 (permalink) Old 06-23-2018, 06:55 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Bergen View Post
That's better than the recommended 4K miles for the four bangers.

That's even worse. So basically on the older 4 bangers, he plugs have to be replaced at every oil change. Wow!
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