5 year old "New" Timing Belts For GL1500 - Page 3 - Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums

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post #21 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-14-2019, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by redwing52 View Post
Valk,
It is not unusual for a belt to look just fine but be broken. They don't usually show signs of failure to the naked eye. It would be like taking your engine apart to see if a connecting rod is going to fail. Can't tell. That is why it is so spooky. Also I agree timing belts can cause emission issues but that is a stretch. (no pun intended) A stretched belt really has no real affect on camshaft timing. If it stretched far enough to cause emission issues the teeth of the belt would not mesh with the sprocket and the engine would not run that way. Emission related components are more likely induction related, sensors, cats etc. I think if you brought your car to your dealer and asked for emission warranty when a belt fails you would have an argument on your hands..

the law/s state anything that can effect emissions mainly on autos/trucks. went into effect in '96. case in point '95 subaru legacy timing belts were rated for 60k, in '96 same car and engines, the belts were now rated for 105k miles, of course it was a different belt and part number.

your analogy of a broken belt I've heard before, from mechanics who remember the early belts in the 1980s car. GL1500 belts are completely different than those '80s belts.
bottom line honda spec'd inspection at 100k miles. I think the engineers knew what they were doing esp for their flagship model. just like when they spec'd 8k oil changes using dino oil tech of 1988.
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post #22 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-14-2019, 06:13 PM
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Well, being told to:
inspect a belt at 100,000 miles &
a belt working to turn a cam at various rpms for years while living in a closed, hot environment &
a belt resting, not flexing, not loaded or tensioned, in a dark box in a dry environment of household temps
are three different things.
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post #23 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-14-2019, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ValkyrieRider View Post
the law/s state anything that can effect emissions mainly on autos/trucks. went into effect in '96. case in point '95 subaru legacy timing belts were rated for 60k, in '96 same car and engines, the belts were now rated for 105k miles, of course it was a different belt and part number.

your analogy of a broken belt I've heard before, from mechanics who remember the early belts in the 1980s car. GL1500 belts are completely different than those '80s belts.
bottom line honda spec'd inspection at 100k miles. I think the engineers knew what they were doing esp for their flagship model. just like when they spec'd 8k oil changes using dino oil tech of 1988.
That makes no sense to me. I looked on the internet and as close as I could find was that in California belts had to last longer because they contained something that California considered dangerous. Can't seem to find it again. Maybe post a few links to help verify some of your claims. It just seems odd.

EDIT: Did find this:
What is the federally mandated warranty for emission controls on my car?

The Clean Air Act requires manufacturers of light-duty vehicles to provide two federal emission control warranties: (A) "Performance Warranty" and (B) "Design and Defect Warranty." These warranties are provided by the vehicle manufacturer and apply to used vehicles as well. The warranty period begins from the date of sale to the original owner.
The Performance Warranty covers repairs which are required during the first 2 years or 24,000 miles of vehicle use (whichever first occurs) because the vehicle failed an emission test. Specified major emission control components are covered for the first 8 years or 80,000 miles (whichever first occurs). The specified major emission control components only include the catalytic converters, the electronic emissions control unit or computer (ECU), and the onboard emissions diagnostic (OBD) device or computer. If you are a resident of an area with an Inspection and Maintenance (I/M) program that meets federal guidelines, you are eligible for this warranty protection provided that:


https://nepis.epa.gov/Exe/ZyPDF.cgi?Dockey=P100NNQH.pdf

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post #24 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-15-2019, 11:31 AM
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yes epa is 80k. so what happened yrs ago was many states had different used car laws and mainly lemon laws which required 100k miles. so manufacturers were starting to be sued, which resulted in the 100k miles emission requirements and the manufacturers building to 100k to satisfy the states. I do not know if all of that is still in effect, but I think it is. the links I had are all gone, but I'm sure a search will bring it up. when I had a '99 dakota I actually received a letter from chrysler indicating all emission related items warranty was increased to 100k miles.
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post #25 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-15-2019, 12:16 PM
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But timing belts are a maintenance item and usually the recommended mileage is less under "extreme conditions", meaning high temperatures. Honda (cars) has had a 105,000 mile interval on them since they started using the 1/2 round tooth belts but 60,000 under "extreme conditions".

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post #26 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-15-2019, 09:41 PM
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I’d use them without hesitation. My father in law stored 2 Goldwings for more than 20 years in a metal shop building. The ‘79 fired right up last year and the belts are still holding up.


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post #27 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-16-2019, 11:24 AM
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This issue flirts with being a myth. The fact that a broken belt will wreck a motor is true. However, I have been monitoring this issue for about 20 yrs and there is no credible evidence that a belt will break with reasonable care. Now I expect there will be several replies where someone knows someone who lost a belt...... I can accept that and still the maintenance frequency question persists. It is also true that organic materials will deteriorate with time and use under stress is another vector to break a belt. So In the past I came up with what I thought to be a reasonable and prudent way to judge the need for changing belts.
The formula for when to change a belt (is) = No of years old the belt is + Number of miles on belt/10,000. (XB = YR OLD + Miles/10k)
If the number for when to change a belt gets to 10 then you change the belt to provide reasonable care. Here is an example: I changed my belt in 2014, ie 5 years ago, and I have ridden 30,000 miles since the belt change. So; XB = 5 + 30,000/10,000, therefore XB = 8. Eight is less than 10 so the next belt change will be in 2 years if I do not ride the bike or sooner if I ride the bike many miles. Granted I still don't know the statistics for when a belt will break however I believe that using the formula will provide you with near 100% confidence that you are getting the value out of the belt without posing a threat to the engine.
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post #28 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-16-2019, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by dnagardner View Post
This issue flirts with being a myth. The fact that a broken belt will wreck a motor is true. However, I have been monitoring this issue for about 20 yrs and there is no credible evidence that a belt will break with reasonable care. Now I expect there will be several replies where someone knows someone who lost a belt...... I can accept that and still the maintenance frequency question persists. It is also true that organic materials will deteriorate with time and use under stress is another vector to break a belt. So In the past I came up with what I thought to be a reasonable and prudent way to judge the need for changing belts.
The formula for when to change a belt (is) = No of years old the belt is + Number of miles on belt/10,000. (XB = YR OLD + Miles/10k)
If the number for when to change a belt gets to 10 then you change the belt to provide reasonable care. Here is an example: I changed my belt in 2014, ie 5 years ago, and I have ridden 30,000 miles since the belt change. So; XB = 5 + 30,000/10,000, therefore XB = 8. Eight is less than 10 so the next belt change will be in 2 years if I do not ride the bike or sooner if I ride the bike many miles. Granted I still don't know the statistics for when a belt will break however I believe that using the formula will provide you with near 100% confidence that you are getting the value out of the belt without posing a threat to the engine.

the motorcycle will rot away before the belt materials will
T275 TIMING BELT

Product # 85950439
  • PTFE-infused jackets to reduce frictional losses and tooth shear.
  • High grade HNBR rubber for superior heat and contamination resistance.
  • Premium tensile members providing maximum strength.
  • Aramid reinforced nylon jackets and backsides increase durability and lifetime.
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post #29 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-17-2019, 12:10 AM
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From Gates:
Belts may be stored up to six years if properly stored at temperatures
less than 85F and relative humidity less than 70%.
Link:
https://www.gatesaustralia.com.au/~/...t-handling.pdf

From Pfeifer Industries:
Timing belt quality will not change significantly within eight (8) years of proper storage
Link:
https://www.pfeiferindustries.com/ti...ndling-storage

From Rubber Manufacturer Association:
A. When belts are properly stored, according to RMA bulletin IP3-4, no significant change in performance should
be detected for up to 8 years. Proper storage, as described in this bulletin, means the belt should be protected from
moisture, temperature extremes, direct sunlight, and high ozone levels. The belt should be stored in it original
package, avoiding sharp bends or crimping that could damage the belt. (date of publication, 2017)
Link:https://www.g/pdf/V837-E_RMA.pdf
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post #30 of 31 (permalink) Old 08-17-2019, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dnagardner View Post
This issue flirts with being a myth. The fact that a broken belt will wreck a motor is true. However, I have been monitoring this issue for about 20 yrs and there is no credible evidence that a belt will break with reasonable care. Now I expect there will be several replies where someone knows someone who lost a belt...... I can accept that and still the maintenance frequency question persists. It is also true that organic materials will deteriorate with time and use under stress is another vector to break a belt. So In the past I came up with what I thought to be a reasonable and prudent way to judge the need for changing belts.
The formula for when to change a belt (is) = No of years old the belt is + Number of miles on belt/10,000. (XB = YR OLD + Miles/10k)
If the number for when to change a belt gets to 10 then you change the belt to provide reasonable care. Here is an example: I changed my belt in 2014, ie 5 years ago, and I have ridden 30,000 miles since the belt change. So; XB = 5 + 30,000/10,000, therefore XB = 8. Eight is less than 10 so the next belt change will be in 2 years if I do not ride the bike or sooner if I ride the bike many miles. Granted I still don't know the statistics for when a belt will break however I believe that using the formula will provide you with near 100% confidence that you are getting the value out of the belt without posing a threat to the engine.
It is a gamble. Would you bet $35 against $3500 on a long shot? Here is an exceptionally bad vehicle. https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C...4dUDCAo&uact=5
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Worked on the "big rigs" for 45 years now just riding my Wing whenever I can. Gets cold in Wisconsin.
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