Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums

Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums (https://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/)
-   Feedback for Hondas Goldwing Team (https://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/9-feedback-hondas-goldwing-team/)
-   -   Honda Warranty and heel-toe shifter (https://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/9-feedback-hondas-goldwing-team/514601-honda-warranty-heel-toe-shifter.html)

TrexxG 06-18-2014 10:27 PM

Honda Warranty and heel-toe shifter
 
Maybe this has been addressed somewhere inside this forum before, but I have a new to me '08 Goldwing 1800. I bought it from my local Honda dealership a couple of weeks ago and bought a two year extended warranty. I hate the stock pegs, very uncomfortable for me, so I installed floorboards with heel-toe shifter and I love them. Now my Honda dealership is telling me that Honda will not honor the warranty on the transmission with a heel-toe shifter installed.

What about this has anyone heard of this before.
What difference does a heel-toe shifter make with or without it.

Any help with this would be much appreciated.

tfdeputydawg 06-18-2014 11:12 PM

Any modification made or any accessory added that is not manufacturer approved and not performed/added by a tech at an authorized dealership MAY cause warranty claims to be rejected if said modification or accessory is determined to have caused the failure.
Note the word MAY.
Depends on the dealer, some will ignore the mod/accessory, especially if that dealer did the unauthorized mod or installed the unapproved accessory.
If the manufacturer's field rep gets involved in a review of the bike, you're pretty much "toast" for having a warranty claim approved.
Also, no matter what others may post the MM law does NOT apply here!!!!

TrexxG 06-18-2014 11:28 PM

Guess I can forget the Mustang seat I wanted next, if Honda can reject warranty for any reason they decide may or may not cause the failure. Sounds to me that Honda just wants to find any excuse they can to not honor warranty. Very disappointing.

Thanks tfdeputydawg for the reply.

tfdeputydawg 06-19-2014 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrexxG (Post 3338569)
Guess I can forget the Mustang seat I wanted next, if Honda can reject warranty for any reason they decide may or may not cause the failure. Sounds to me that Honda just wants to find any excuse they can to not honor warranty. Very disappointing.

Thanks tfdeputydawg for the reply.

That's a little "over the top"!
Have never heard of, for instance, a tranny failure being blamed on an after market seat!!!!
I have heard of tranny claims rejected for heel/toe shifters and trailer hitches.
My original statement covers ALL manufacturers, not just Honda.

Dxlnt1 06-19-2014 07:17 AM

I was told by another dealer and rider the same thing. Honda will NOT warranty transmission due to slop in heel toe shifter. The added vibrations causes added stress to shifting mechanisms. Dont remember much past that. I removed my heel toe shifter partially for that reason, and my foot was too big and caused me to occassionally miss gears.

TrexxG 06-19-2014 10:46 AM

tfdeputydawg sorry for the over the top statement.. just hate to eat $350.00 dollars for something I cannot use and not knowing enough to even ask before I bought the floorboards.

Is there any other set up that someone might recommend other than the stock pegs, the position for me on my Wing using the stock pegs is hard on my knees. My old VTX 1800 came with stock floorboards and heel-toe shifter and I have been riding it for years now with no knee problems.

Help would be appreciated.. thanks

tfdeputydawg 06-19-2014 04:04 PM

The foot behind the knee position on a Wing was also painful for me!
When I triked, I made sure I picked one w/weight bearing foot fairings. Off came the pegs!
You might consider some hi-way pegs that mount to the front tip over bars to put your feet out in front of your knees until you need to shift or brake.
You might also be interested in Mic-O-Pegs. http://www.ridingiswonderful.com/

TrexxG 06-19-2014 10:22 PM

Thanks tfdeputydawg..
Very interesting.. I have just ordered mini-boards with an adjustable adapters for my Wing.. I will let everyone know how they work out for me.

Peppi-Le-Pew 07-06-2014 10:40 PM

All of this can be confusing. Using 15w40 oil in a bike rated for 10w40 can technically void a warranty. The dealer or manufacturer can claim that the oil caused, or contributed to the failure. It will then be upon you to show otherwise. That is a bad place to be. Having a hitch in itself is no cause for voiding a warranty. You may have been using it for a cargo carrying rack. If they start asking allot of questions when trying to determine cause for failure, then watch out, someone is looking for a reason to get out of warranting the repair. Honda, or any manufacturer will generally honor whatever the service manager decides to cover. Transmissions without heel-toe shifters, or hitches fail. Engines with the manufacturer recommended oil fail. I now have 11K on my 2012. I have done oil changes at the recommended interval. My engine has a quite loud washing machine noise. I will have to produce records showing maintenance with the correct consumables, within the correct time frame, when making a claim under the warranty guidelines. The key word is guidelines. It would be unreasonable to void a warranty because you went 4100 miles between recommended oil changes, instead of 4000 miles.

Just my .02 cents.

I would remove any aftermarket accessory effecting the failed component, before bringing the bike in for a potential warranty repair.

tfdeputydawg 07-07-2014 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peppi-Le-Pew (Post 3388689)
All of this can be confusing. Using 15w40 oil in a bike rated for 10w40 can technically void a warranty.
Not as long as it meets or exceeds the manufacturers specifications.
Having a hitch in itself is no cause for voiding a warranty. You may have been using it for a cargo carrying rack.
While a true statement, how are you going to prove you never pulled a trailer, BTW, not pulling a trailer warning is in the owners manual!
Honda, or any manufacturer will generally honor whatever the service manager decides to cover.
Somewhat correct, except when it comes to major drive train failures. The factory reps are getting more and more involved in these failures.
Transmissions without heel-toe shifters, or hitches fail. Engines with the manufacturer recommended oil fail. I now have 11K on my 2012. I have done oil changes at the recommended interval. My engine has a quite loud washing machine noise. I will have to produce records showing maintenance with the correct consumables, within the correct time frame, when making a claim under the warranty guidelines. The key word is guidelines. It would be unreasonable to void a warranty because you went 4100 miles between recommended oil changes, instead of 4000 miles.

Just my .02 cents.

I would remove any aftermarket accessory effecting the failed component, before bringing the bike in for a potential warranty repair.
I would not install them to start with! If you have, for instance, a tranny failure 1000 miles from home, will you be able to remove your boards,heel/toe shifter and trailer hitch????

Heel/toe shifters and trailer hitches are the only accessories I have "head" of that can cause warranty claim rejections. Anybody heard of any others on Wings?

rayworx 07-07-2014 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tfdeputydawg (Post 3389049)
Heel/toe shifters and trailer hitches are the only accessories I have "headrd" off that can cause warranty claim rejuctions. Anybody heard of any others on Wings?

The first thing I think of is oil filters. Saw one where Honda flat denied the warranty coverage. This was years ago on a GL1200. Course I couldn't blame them.. the Non-Honda oil filter came apart, scattered pieces of glue up inside the engine and one piece clogged the oil port at the cylinder head gasket area. Seized the cam, rockers, cylinder head.. all in one fell swoop. The customer was bragging what a deal he got on these cheap-o imported filters….. a case of them for $20 or something like that.

For the most part the previous statements about Honda not honoring the warranty is mostly correct. If (that's a big IF) Honda suspects the added accessory LED to OR CAUSED the component failure they have the right to refuse warranty repairs. This isn't just Honda…. any other OEM will do the same thing.

Personal experience here: I ran the service dept of an aftermarket shop dealing with primarily GoldWings some years back. Customer comes in with a triked GL1500 with what sounds like burnt shift fork sounds. Was also trying to engage 2 gears at the same time. I've heard it before so it was fairly obvious. He had heel-toe-shifter and floorboards on his trike. I asked about the adjustment… he said he'd never adjusted it. The adjustment felt ok so I enquired about possibly if he'd rest his toe on the rear arm of the shifter. This particular brand had a spot he could rest his foot but he might also hit the shift lever. This would put pressure on the transmission forks and cause failure. He swore up and down that he NEVER rested his foot there. Repeatedly he swore… NEVER, EVER.

His wife was listening to the questions and his answers…. she 'corrected him' (I put that mildly) "YOU DO IT ALL THE TIME YOU IDIOT!!"
Seems he did it subconsciously!!

Anyway… there's a double standard here that sort of stinks. Honda will refuse the warranty on your GL because you've put a heel-toe shifter on it but they make the VTX with floorboards and heel-toe shifters.
Their response to me was: we didn't make the aftermarket version. So what they are saying is that when they install it at the factory it's installed and adjusted properly.

Misadjusting the heel-toe shifter could do the same as riding your foot on the lever.

Peppi-Le-Pew 07-07-2014 09:51 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peppi-Le-Pew View Post
All of this can be confusing. Using 15w40 oil in a bike rated for 10w40 can technically void a warranty.

Not as long as it meets or exceeds the manufacturers specifications.

Having a hitch in itself is no cause for voiding a warranty. You may have been using it for a cargo carrying rack.

While a true statement, how are you going to prove you never pulled a trailer, BTW, not pulling a trailer warning is in the owners manual!


I have pics of the rack, and have never registered a trailer.


Honda, or any manufacturer will generally honor whatever the service manager decides to cover.

Somewhat correct, except when it comes to major drive train failures. The factory reps are getting more and more involved in these failures.

Yes, this statement is true. Not just Honda, auto manufactures are doing the same. It has more to do with warranty fraud, costs, and mis-diagnosis than anything else. Manufactures just keep making the unit without change, so it has little to do with post R/D.


Transmissions without heel-toe shifters, or hitches fail. Engines with the manufacturer recommended oil fail. I now have 11K on my 2012. I have done oil changes at the recommended interval. My engine has a quite loud washing machine noise. I will have to produce records showing maintenance with the correct consumables, within the correct time frame, when making a claim under the warranty guidelines. The key word is guidelines. It would be unreasonable to void a warranty because you went 4100 miles between recommended oil changes, instead of 4000 miles.

Just my .02 cents.

I would remove any aftermarket accessory effecting the failed component, before bringing the bike in for a potential warranty repair.

I would not install them to start with! If you have, for instance, a tranny failure 1000 miles from home, will you be able to remove your boards,heel/toe shifter and trailer hitch????


I carry a set of tools to do minor repairs on the road. I can do the work myself. Something most don't have the luxury of doing. I also know what to, and not to say under examination of the rep or service manager. Transmissions give tell tale warnings of imminent failure. Anyone traveling long distances with noisy components is opening themselves to problems.


Heel/toe shifters and trailer hitches are the only accessories I have "head" of that can cause warranty claim rejections. Anybody heard of any others on Wings?
Quote:

Originally Posted by tfdeputydawg (Post 3389049)
Heel/toe shifters and trailer hitches are the only accessories I have "head" of that can cause warranty claim rejections. Anybody heard of any others on Wings?



I have warranty claims from my customers at my transmission shop. In seventeen I have voided 2 warranties. I did work something out with both of them to repair the customer caused failures. I want people to send others and return for future repairs. Honda is no different. A warranty is not an excuse to abuse. Adding a hitch to a truck not rated for the task it is being asked to do is just cause for voiding a warranty. Adding a plow to a half ton truck after rebuilding a trans is just cause for voiding a warranty.

None of us want to be in a position of submitting a warranty claim. We just want to continue with our lives without inconvenience. Humans by nature are creatures of convenience.

rayworx 07-09-2014 04:44 PM

Honda, or any manufacturer will generally honor whatever the service manager decides to cover.

Somewhat correct, except when it comes to major drive train failures. The factory reps are getting more and more involved in these failures.




[/B][/quote]

Honda is becoming more involved in expensive warranty repairs/claims. As of when I left the dealership level Honda REQUIRED the Service Rep to be involved with any claim that included the Engine Assembly, Transmission, Frame or Carburetor/ Injector Assemblies.

So if a service manager handed in a claim that included a transmission overhaul he/she can be sure that claim will be instantly rejected if it doesn't have the Representative code on it. All codes are monitored by Honda

DriverRider 07-11-2014 03:59 PM

:-)

Not all dealership service departments are created equal. Big dollar claims can be made and the bike was never worked on just a paper trail, which is another reason why the factory reps get involved to keep everybody honest.

There is the warranty book time and the more generous customer pay time for a given repair. And there is also the shop posted labor rate and the lower rate at which the Dealer gets reimbursed from the manufacturer, they do not pay the $100/hr you or I would.

Dealers do not trip over each other looking for (shirt loss) warranty work when the profit is in customer pay work.

Back in the 80's I worked for a very successful car dealer that between new, used and leased would blow out 160 units per month and we were No. 1 in our zone. Word was out that if you wanted your vehicle fixed correctly they would come to us after buying somewhere else.

The added warranty work was bringing down shop profitability and the repair end was given a visiting owner exemption status by the Manufacturer. Meaning if the vehicle was bought within 50 miles and was driveable we could refer the owner back to the selling Dealer, outside 50 miles and they were considered a visiting owner and the needed work done.

rayworx 07-16-2014 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DriverRider (Post 3399313)
:-)

Not all dealership service departments are created equal. Big dollar claims can be made and the bike was never worked on just a paper trail, which is another reason why the factory reps get involved to keep everybody honest.

There is the warranty book time and the more generous customer pay time for a given repair. And there is also the shop posted labor rate and the lower rate at which the Dealer gets reimbursed from the manufacturer, they do not pay the $100/hr you or I would.

Dealers do not trip over each other looking for (shirt loss) warranty work when the profit is in customer pay work.

Back in the 80's I worked for a very successful car dealer that between new, used and leased would blow out 160 units per month and we were No. 1 in our zone. Word was out that if you wanted your vehicle fixed correctly they would come to us after buying somewhere else.

The added warranty work was bringing down shop profitability and the repair end was given a visiting owner exemption status by the Manufacturer. Meaning if the vehicle was bought within 50 miles and was driveable we could refer the owner back to the selling Dealer, outside 50 miles and they were considered a visiting owner and the needed work done.

I like the idea of the 'visiting owner'. Honda has nothing like that…. as of 2004 when I left. We were getting a lot of the warranty from other selling dealers but for the most part we let it work for us…. especially on the water craft side. There was a warranty update that had to do with the injector throttle bodies. The entire rack had to be replaced and Honda paid over 3hrs for the entire job. I was doing them in 1.5 hrs. I was hunting down any water craft available!! What a money maker.
On the labor side Honda does pay the same rate a customer pays (per hour) on their warranty claims. The customer pays $75 per hour, so does Honda. So the difference is only on the time to do the job. That's where a quality tech becomes important.

Apatz 08-21-2015 03:50 PM

Here's a thought
 
33 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dxlnt1 (Post 3339169)
I was told by another dealer and rider the same thing. Honda will NOT warranty transmission due to slop in heel toe shifter. The added vibrations causes added stress to shifting mechanisms. Dont remember much past that. I removed my heel toe shifter partially for that reason, and my foot was too big and caused me to occassionally miss gears.

My Kuryakani heel toe shifter merely shifts the OEM shift pedal. So a fork shifting the same pedal is different than my toe shifting that very same pedal is different how?

CrystalPistol 08-25-2015 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apatz (Post 4169914)
... etc ... So a fork shifting the same pedal is different than my toe shifting that very same pedal is different how?

Maybe not so much when shifting without excessive effort is all one does.


Problems arise when folks stomp down with the heal (not the light tug of a toe,rather the weight of the whole leg dropping) or rest the foot on the shifter (applying pressure against a fork maybe) as they ride.

DaveO430 08-29-2015 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrystalPistol (Post 4179970)


or rest the foot on the shifter (applying pressure against a fork maybe) as they ride.

They might use that as an excuse but the fact is when it's in 5th the shift drum has moved as far as it can go and holding pressure on the shifter should have no effect. The thing is a helpful dealer does not have to report to Honda that one has a heel/toe shifter. Just fix it, collect the money from Honda and everyone's happy.

Sean G. 08-29-2015 04:41 PM

I did a search on the forum looking for the word "crack" coupled with the word "fairing" and came up with a bunch of threads that deal with fairing repairs of older Wings.
My 05 Goldwing has a crack in the fairing and I have the extended warranty to boot, but wonder if anyone else has had this issue, and if so, does Honda cover this type of thing?
It's actually where the fairing is quite thin beneath the headlight on left side (while facing the bike)


I have even tried to look of the cost of the part and had no luck with that on the Honda website.


Any help out there???

AZgl1800 08-29-2015 05:07 PM

876 Attachment(s)
My 1800 is 12 years old, and there are tiny little imperfections here and there.

Nearly everyone of them can be traced to the PO rough housing his way with sloppy maintenance approaches... stripped out screw holes, big coarse threaded screws where a fahnstock spring clip with a metal threaded nut is supposed to be.

all things that over time, I will resolve.... but for now, it looks just fine from 3 feet away, and I am going riding.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:49 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Shoutbox provided by vBShout v6.2.1 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome