Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums banner

Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 20 of 30 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
12 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I have a 1982 GL1100a,I want to go with a 4 into 1 carb conversion, what and who would be the best resource to get it.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,328 Posts
imported post

No real best..I am not sure but I don't think anyone is still making new manifolds for this conversion. Most buy old Webers 32/36..from VW's or Solexs and find manifolds on eBay.

One guy made his own manifold using PVC pipe and the original intake elbows..I'll look around through my bookmarks..

Cycle Innovations had one..and some use holly 5200'S (WEBERS) single or double barrel carbs on them
 

·
The Irish Crew
Joined
·
3,932 Posts
imported post

I think most are discontinued, like the one by Cycle Innovations. A few members have adapted other single carbs, hang on for a while and they will chime in. CaptainMidnight85 and some of the other lads know a lot on the subject and we should see them here later.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
12,287 Posts
imported post

Thanks Al. :waving:

Jerry, why do you want to go with a single carburetor conversion?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,851 Posts
imported post

There was a single carburetor conversion for 1200s on eBay a month or so ago.

I sent Bike and Dennis the information at the time.

Gunbyred
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,837 Posts
imported post

I'll start off by saying a early wing with 4 new carbs is a great ride. Unfortunatly that newness can wear off quickly.
The other major issue here is that carbed engines from the 80's sucked no matter how many carbs because of the smog laws forced on the manufactures. carbs just can't handle that like FI so they suffer.
Not likely anyone will build a off the shelf conversion for the wings now as the demand is not there for R&D to get a good product out.
I'm thinking the cost would have to be at lest $2000 and I don't see to many old wing ownners linning up for that.
Some one could probly put together a efi kit for not much more and have a sweet running bike ut again don't see the market as most of us old wing ownners are cheapskates!!
wilf
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
14 Posts
imported post

Here is one that I make. It can accept a 1bbl or 2bbl. I prefer the Weber 32/36. different folks may have other ideas, but I got to tell you this works great, and fits under the shelter. PM me if I can help.

 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
26,578 Posts
imported post

That's a nice looking setup HOTT, how much do you get for the manifold?
 

·
Piled Higher and Deeper
Joined
·
4,513 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
14 Posts
imported post

DaveO430 wrote:
That's a nice looking setup HOTT, how much do you get for the manifold?
Thanks Dave,
The manifold is $225.00 for 1bbl and $250.00 for 2bbl set-up.
Ric
 

·
Piled Higher and Deeper
Joined
·
4,513 Posts
imported post

I like this one.. so many of the others that I have seen are rigidly attached to the heads.. this one uses the OEM boots that allow some expansion... Is it stainless or Aluminum?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
14 Posts
imported post

Thanks,
I do them in stainless. There are a couple of good reasons to keep the stock runners.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
12,287 Posts
imported post

sandiegobrass wrote:
...so many of the others that I have seen are rigidly attached to the heads..
this one uses the OEM boots that allow some expansion...
Jim, what other manifolds are rigidly mounted? Silicon Sam comes close, but even he's rubber isolated. I do recall one other fella over at the NGW site that did a rigid manifold. Could be more I suppose.

Why would expansion be a issue? Are you saying the mounting bolt locations spread from each other with the amount of heat generated by the engine?Isn't your1500 intake manifold rigidly mounted?

I know this issue of "expansion" as a non-issue.

...Curious to your thinking on this. :)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
72 Posts
imported post

So what would it cost to have this manifold made?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,013 Posts
imported post

Hey Hott, great looking setup. How much more fabricating had to be done to convert to the single carb, (brackets for linkage and cables and such)
If we could get a group buy together could you offer a lower price.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
12,287 Posts
imported post

It is nice to see that someone picked-up where LD left-off. Good Job HOTT. :claps:
 

·
Piled Higher and Deeper
Joined
·
4,513 Posts
imported post

CaptainMidnight85 wrote:
sandiegobrass wrote:
...so many of the others that I have seen are rigidly attached to the heads..
this one uses the OEM boots that allow some expansion...
Jim, what other manifolds are rigidly mounted? Silicon Sam comes close, but even he's rubber isolated. I do recall one other fella over at the NGW site that did a rigid manifold. Could be more I suppose.

Why would expansion be a issue? Are you saying the mounting bolt locations spread from each other with the amount of heat generated by the engine?Isn't your1500 intake manifold rigidly mounted?

I know this issue of "expansion" as a non-issue.

...Curious to your thinking on this. :)
As I recall, I worked out the expansion at something a little less than 1/16" cold to hot.. and I only have one data point (meaning one failed design) for a rigid system .. they were selling the single carb manifold but withdrew it from the market because it was cracking (don't remember timeframe, but in the last couple years)... if I can find the stuff I'll post it... other than that I have no other evidence, just something I would call a potential issue to be concerned about..

I haven't had my 1500 manifold off yet, so I'll just take your word for it... but keep in mind, the 1500 is built like a piping expansion loop.. with the high loop, it can take a lot more expansion than a low direct coupled solid...

And since you have actually built one (or more), you probably know that it works for some extended time without an expansion joint.. and it may be fine for a couple thousand cycles... which is all you'd need.... but I'd still put one in...
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
12,287 Posts
imported post

sandiegobrass wrote:
CaptainMidnight85 wrote:
sandiegobrass wrote:
...so many of the others that I have seen are rigidly attached to the heads..
this one uses the OEM boots that allow some expansion...
Jim, what other manifolds are rigidly mounted? Silicon Sam comes close, but even he's rubber isolated. I do recall one other fella over at the NGW site that did a rigid manifold. Could be more I suppose.

Why would expansion be a issue? Are you saying the mounting bolt locations spread from each other with the amount of heat generated by the engine?Isn't your1500 intake manifold rigidly mounted?

I know this issue of "expansion" as a non-issue.

...Curious to your thinking on this. :)
As I recall, I worked out the expansion at something a little less than 1/16" cold to hot.. and I only have one data point (meaning one failed design) for a rigid system .. they were selling the single carb manifold but withdrew it from the market because it was cracking (don't remember timeframe, but in the last couple years)... if I can find the stuff I'll post it... other than that I have no other evidence, just something I would call a potential issue to be concerned about..

I haven't had my 1500 manifold off yet, so I'll just take your word for it... but keep in mind, the 1500 is built like a piping expansion loop.. with the high loop, it can take a lot more expansion than a low direct coupled solid...

And since you have actually built one (or more), you probably know that it works for some extended time without an expansion joint.. and it may be fine for a couple thousand cycles... which is all you'd need.... but I'd still put one in...

Ok Jim, I see your POV now. Thanks. :)

I do recall one Fella over at NGW that built a all-metal manifold. Not really any different than mine. Certainly there are others that I'm unaware of. I truly know of no others though.

Myself, I've had two failures, but they were intentionally made to fail by others. Two welds, one each per manifold, were "froze" while at (or hotter) NOT to cause failure by cracking. Two individuals actually furthered testing beyond any that my interest had, ...little did they realize at the time. Aside from this, I've had no failures of any sort under any riding condition.

I've looked at this issue of "expansion" early-on from side-to-side and have witnessed none with a 4-cylinder GL. Actually, I've built manifolds for the XV750, 920 and 1000 and never noticed any issue of expansion of mounting points from cyclinder-to-cylinder on those V-twin, air-cooled engines. There is a well known maker of manifolds for them as well, KJM Enterprises. He's been building them for many years without a single report of failure due to this "expansion" issue that has crept-up as of late. I've built them for the in-line XS's and GS's also. Never a problem.

Our water-cooled GL engines are far less prone to this purported phenonenom than any air-cooled V-twin would be, yes?

Any arguement to a GL's rubber boots (4-cylinder) or 2-piece manifold (6-cylinder) is soley based in serviceability to the Owner or shop for maintenance purposes, and has nothing to do with "expansion" side-to-side. If the factory 10/11/12 Keihins were somehow "rigidly" mounted then they could not be installed or removed from the bike, simply put. A 6-cylinder is in halves for a like issue of ease in servicing. With the mounting locations (intake port locations) being somewhat directly overhead of TDC, I seriously doubt Honda would allow for a varying C/R if the issue were one based in fact. If this issue were one of fact and not hypothesis, then why have there been no cracking failures of exhaust manifolds which deal with much more heat than any intake manifold?

This issue of cracked manifolds, as best I know, stems from my own revelation of others doing a dirty deed, and them furthered by another with his own agenda. If anyone has real-world experience in this area other than comments derived from myself, I really would like to know. Maybe we can figure out what is really going on. I know of none, and more than willing to listen.

I hope the above helps put this fiction to rest.

My own experience says that I need a heated manifold. This is why I've taken the route I've taken. Others will agree. My thanks to a retired GM induction designer, Tom Langdon, for his input to me. It was invaluable. I initially started with no heat and had tuning issues as some may remember. Tom pointed me in the right direction when he didn't have to. Great Guy. Look him up for carburtetors.

The above is my experience doing things my way with the suggestion of others however it came. Mostly input from Steve's site here. I do believe I have a trouble-free bike today because of the encouragement of people on this site.

It is good to see HOTT helping others. I've follwed his doings over at NGW and I'm impressed. Good job, Man. Taking something from ones own garage and getting it to where another can have the same takes more than most are willing to spend in time, effort and resources. It ain't for the Meek to attempt. My meaniing of picking it up where LD left off centers on your manifold being capable of single or dual-barrel carbs. LD missed that part IMO, but he was offering complete and specific conversion kits. MANY unheated manifolds out there working just fine for the people that have them. If it's good enough for them, then that is what counts. Options are always good. If you could find some way to heat it, then drivability issues may disappear that you may not have encountered yet. If I can help you in any way, let me know.

Jerry, options are out there. I more or less started here in similar shoes. You're going to get many varying opinions on this subject. Pick what will work for you. HOTT's manifold should work fine for you in your climate in Georgia I would think. Those 45-50 degree days with high humidity might be of some small issue. Might not be. Run it and find out. He's got a really good price compared to what others are asking if he can do it. Get the CI manual for set-up. It's as close as you'll get for something to put you in a ballpark of tuning. The factory manual goes out the door in this ballpark.

PM Silicon Sam if he's still around. He runs a great manifold that is also heated (oil) if you choose the heated route. A manifold that is so simple it's almost scary. I've built his type (not of his design as I understand it, but..) of manifold also. Works very well.

My Solex set-up has a slight issue with heating. My adapter is the cause. It is not heated, and it needs to be. It creates a problematic venturi effect compounded by the plenum area beneath it, that under the right ambient air/humidity condition, or with low enough temperatures, will cause atomized fuel to go solid and stick to the adapters side-walls until heat from the heated plenum transfers to it. Twenty degree weather or colder and will happen no matter what. I have to go WOT, under load to break it free after warm-up. I'm working a solution. A hard piece to heat without going to electrics (which might be the best solution, actually.) A insulated throttle-grip warmer is probably all that is need. Haven't tried it yet. Run a two-barrel carb and icing is a non-issue on my set-up.

Long post, yes... Hope it helps.
 
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top