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Vintage Rider
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is what Honda is unleashing on the teenagers of America. This thing is fully street legal, and costs $2999. All of Honda's commercial videos for this thing have been something like this. I sure don't see how this can be good for the future of motorcycling. Kids who buy this thing are going to wind up losing their license, getting seriously injured, or killed. And look at what this one is wearing.

We already have enough adults on crotch rockets around here ruining the image of motorcycling and motorcyclists, this is IMO anyway, going to make things worse. Kids are wanting these things BECAUSE they have seen the videos. I don't think Honda thought this one through. Sure they will probably sell these things by the boatload, But it seems to be the worst thing they could do to older riders who have real money to buy real bikes. It wouldn't bother me if they weren't street legal, but Honda seems to be doing their best to encourage this kind of riding on the streets and public property.


 

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Ok, I kind of see where you're coming from, but I kind of don't see it. The sport bike culture isn't going to go away just because someone wants it to. This thing is little more than an over glorified dirt bike with street tires and a barely recognizable "sport"-style "tank". For cryin' out loud it's a 125. At $3000, most "zoom-splats" will end up opting for the 250 Ninja for the extra $1500. And just so we're clear, at 125cc, it's NOT fully street legal (no freeways at least) and not really fast enough to be extremely dangerous. Let's face it, a Vespa 150 only does 45 with my fat a$$ on it, and I'm not even that fat... how fast you think this thing will really go?

I will admit, their marketing has a somewhat disturbing undertone, but they have to market to the folks who are gonna buy it, so what do you expect?

For those curious, here's the full "scoop".....

http://powersports.honda.com/2014/grom.aspx
 

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Vintage Rider
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
perhaps. Those arent us streets, and it wouldnt be legal here...
Sadly it is. It should be in U.S. dealers in about a month.

http://powersports.honda.com/2014/grom.aspx

All of the supposed responsible adult riders on another forum are going nuts over these things. Many of these are riders that have ridden around the world. Many want one for themselves, and think it's cool that Honda is putting these things in the hands of kids.

First my city outlawed gopeds, pocket bikes, then they outlawed skateboards on city sidewalks, and created an ordinance allowing private property owners like shopping malls, private parking lots, and sidewalks to ban them as well. They were mostly a nuisance, but several people did get knocked down by them and injured. I can't wait to see what happens when kids trade in their skateboards and BMX bikes for these. Hopefully Honda will pull them out of the U.S. market soon.
 

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Vintage Rider
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Ok, I kind of see where you're coming from, but I kind of don't see it. The sport bike culture isn't going to go away just because someone wants it to. This thing is little more than an over glorified dirt bike with street tires and a barely recognizable "sport"-style "tank". For cryin' out loud it's a 125. At $3000, most "zoom-splats" will end up opting for the 250 Ninja for the extra $1500. And just so we're clear, at 125cc, it's NOT fully street legal (no freeways at least) and not really fast enough to be extremely dangerous. Let's face it, a Vespa 150 only does 45 with my fat a$$ on it, and I'm not even that fat... how fast you think this thing will really go?

I will admit, their marketing has a somewhat disturbing undertone, but they have to market to the folks who are gonna buy it, so what do you expect?

For those curious, here's the full "scoop".....

http://powersports.honda.com/2014/grom.aspx
Hopefully the "sport bike culture" can at least be reined in by law enforcement, when they figure out how to catch these guys without endangering other lives, and by rising insurance premiums. From what I have seen over the past few years, sportbike riders present more of a danger to the public than the Hells Angels ever did. Maybe some sort of legislative action is needed, though I am not a fan of doing things that way.

I used to own a 2007 Ninja 250. You don't really see many of them being ridden irresponsibly, certainly nothing like in that video. It's mostly 600cc and up sport bikes that get ridden like that. Supersport bikes are nothing but street legal roadracers, they were not designed for stop and go street riding.

When I had my Ninja 250 (about 2 1/2 years) I was stopped by the cops four times. I got one no points violation, I still don't believe I did anything wrong. The cops saw what looked like a sport bike and pulled me over. The cops have learned to hate sport bike riders, and the way they ride they probably deserve it. If you are on a sport bike, you are a cop magnet, and they are not likely to give you a break. And they are getting better at catching them.

I believe sport bike riders are giving all other riders a bad reputation. Honda came up with a whole new image in the '60s to try and get away from the "bad boy" "outlaw" image most motorcyclists had back then, and it worked.

I think they just took a major step backwards. They already have adults doing crazy irresponsible riding on larger sport bikes. They are aiming this directly at teenagers. Looks like they are trying to teach them irresponsible riding from the beginning, and that is definitely not good for the motorcycle industry or motorcycling in general. These kids don't want Ninja 250s. These are the skateboard/goped/ BMX bike/Xbox/Playstation type, the type that so often run into trouble with the law. Even though these are only 125s, they can reach speeds over 60 mph, and in lower gears are capable of all kinds of stunt riding. These kids don't want to ride on the freeway. They want to terrorize inner city streets and parking lots.

Maybe a coincidence, but the ONLY time I have been stopped by the cops on a motorcycle was on that Ninja 250. I'm sure it's appearance is what attracted them.

I also have a Vino 125 and a Zuma 125. They are totally incapable of that kind of riding because of their CVT transmission and lack of a clutch. Makes you wonder why they did not put a CVT transmission and ABS on those things, so they could not be ridden in that manner. Or was that not done on purpose?

Anyway, I can't wait to see what happens when these things hit the street.
 

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Here's another way to think of it Jerry... you have a 16 year old kid who is determined to get a motorcycle and they've saved up about 3k. They want a sport bike. Would you rather they buy the Grom, or a used CBR or GXR? You might say "I'd just tell them no"... ok, so then when they're 18 and you can't stop them they'll get the GXR anyway but they'll be even more dangerous because now its about making a statement.

Another thing to think about is that there is a large portion of the population that thinks all harley riders are hell's angles. Obviously they're not even close to right, but they have that perception. The Rebel 250 is basically supposed to be a baby harley for beginners. Are you saying those should be outlawed because they encourage young people to join biker gangs? How about the Nighthawk 250? Is the Nighthawk not considered by many to be a "sport bike"? Is the 250 not marketed to teens? The Ninja 250? How about that little 250 suzuki? The point is, where do we draw the line? You say this bike is dangerous because of what it encourages, but all those other bikes either encourage the same or equally as bad things in many peoples eyes and all of them have been around for years and are bigger and more dangerous and ARE fully street legal, freeway and all. Where's your call to action for those bikes?

I think this bike is a decent alternative to these cheap chinese scooters and no more dangerous. Will it sell? Doubt it, there's too many bigger options for that demographic in that price range. Should it be taken off the street? I'm just not seeing a viable argument for that...
 

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And your argument about the stunts is kinda stretching it. If I go buy a jeep and try to jump it over a dry river be I could crash and hurt myself. Should jeeps be outlawed? No, my dumb a$$ just shouldn't be jumping over dry river beds...
 

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Vintage Rider
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
And your argument about the stunts is kinda stretching it. If I go buy a jeep and try to jump it over a dry river be I could crash and hurt myself. Should jeeps be outlawed? No, my dumb a$$ just shouldn't be jumping over dry river beds...
Yes, but I'm going to have to assume you have more intelligence than most teenagers I know, and are not a reckless rider. I have done some very reckless riding, and been hurt a few times. On a dirt bike out in the middle of the desert. Your dry river bed is probably not going to be in town either.

Like I said, I'll just wait and see what happens. Honda may be a bit slow in releasing these things in volume, to find out what happens. To the best of my knowledge, this is the first time Honda (or any other motorcycle manufacturer) has sold a bike like this in the U.S. I see a lot of kids doing stunts in the streets and parking lots, just like they do right now on their skateboards and BMX bikes.

That is what Honda's advertising shows it being used for. Of course it doesn't HAVE to be ridden that way, but it looks like that is what it was intended for. It actually looks like it would be pretty boring being ridden in a responsible manner, which is required for street riding. Teenagers don't seem to care for scooters (except the Honda Ruckus) because they are boring and do not fit their "image"
 

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Honda’s 2014 Grom™ is a fresh, new way to add some fun, practicality, independence and style to your life. Fun: This new machine is a blast to ride, offering all the excitement of a full-sized motorcycle but in a package that just about anyone old enough to have a license can handle. Practical: The Grom's thrifty Honda engine means you can run it on pocket change, and you can park it just about anywhere too.

Independence: With your own wheels, you can bag the bus and forget about having to beg for rides from your friends or—shudder—your Mom. Stylish: Check out the Grom for yourself. And then think of it as a blank canvas, waiting for you to customize it.

The new Honda Grom. Big attitude. Ride one and see.
Well at least I won't be bumming any rides from my mom anymore!:claps:
 

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Ok, I kind of see where you're coming from, but I kind of don't see it. The sport bike culture isn't going to go away just because someone wants it to. This thing is little more than an over glorified dirt bike with street tires and a barely recognizable "sport"-style "tank". For cryin' out loud it's a 125. At $3000, most "zoom-splats" will end up opting for the 250 Ninja for the extra $1500. And just so we're clear, at 125cc, it's NOT fully street legal (no freeways at least) and not really fast enough to be extremely dangerous. Let's face it, a Vespa 150 only does 45 with my fat a$$ on it, and I'm not even that fat... how fast you think this thing will really go?

I will admit, their marketing has a somewhat disturbing undertone, but they have to market to the folks who are gonna buy it, so what do you expect?

For those curious, here's the full "scoop".....

http://powersports.honda.com/2014/grom.aspx
That hunk of junk is not street legal in USA, no speedo and only light is a brake light, not even a headlight on it LOL
Junk for idiots! LOL Nothing but a stunt bike!
Not even a decent trail bike it don't look like!
Definitely off road use only.

As far as size though, it would be fully street legal if it was setup to be. I had a street legal Honda 100 as a kid and when I started riding streets with a license at 16 I could do 60mph on Interstates etc.. just fine though that was about top speed unless I really pushed it HARD.
That was riding solo or double also.
Minimum speed is 45mph on Interstates ( of course you'd get ran over at that speed most places ).

My 100 was setup for street/trail, (looked like a street bike, all the lights and speedo etc. but would climb hills ) so sprockets were mid range to do both street and hills decent. If I would have changed the sprocket ratio for just street riding I could have got better speed at lower rpm also, course I would have lost most the hill climbing power.

Heck, my mini trail 50 would do 30mph!

If any street 150 cannot do at least 60mph it's certainly junk! LOL
I never rode a Vespa or even looked close at one, but if it's called a 150 and can't do better than 45mph something bad is wrong! It's either not a true 150 or has 3" tires or geared to ride up a 90% hill LOL
 

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JerryH, The Grom reminds me very much of my early "70"s" CT 70. Except for the 125cc engine.
I think one would be great fun.
They should sell like hotcakes.
You sound like Chicken Little.
I do not share your concerns.
 

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Vintage Rider
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Unfortunately it actually is street legal. If it weren't, I would never have even noticed it. There are a lot of small dirt bikes out there capable of more performance than this thing. And if you want to ride like that off road, fine. That's what off road is for. But this thing is being marketed directly at teenagers, as a street legal stunt bike. It's not just another small bike. I also wouldn't have noticed it if it were like an old Honda CB125 or a Trail 110. I have no problems with mopeds or scooters. I own a Puch moped, and two 125cc scooters. Small displacement scooters are performance limited by the CVT transmissions. I can usually get them up to around 50-55. The moped is 30 mph only. I also have a genuine Stella 2 stroke manual shift scooter, which is a blast to ride (legally) But none of these bikes even begin to have the stunt capabilities of what Honda has here. This is a bike with but one purpose. If it were about transportation, why not a scooter? It is worthless in the dirt, it is more of a mini supermoto.

We never got the MB80 here if I remember correctly. We had the MB5, which was 50cc. It was a tiny little motorcycle, again completely incapable of what is being shown in the videos for this thing.

Perhaps my reaction to this thing is because it is the first such bike ever sold here. Kids had gopeds. They were outlawed because the kids were irresponsible with them. Then pocket bikes. Same thing happened. Even skateboards have been outlawed in 90% of my city. "Skateboard punks" tend to hang out around shopping malls (though they don't buy anything) you should see them scatter when they see a cop.

I grew up riding dirt bikes and doing stupid things on them. Out in the desert or in the middle of a field. I got my MC license at 16, and bought a used Suzuki GT380, a bike certainly capable of wheelies and stoppies. Not once did I ever do anything stupid or irresponsible on it. No tickets, no accidents. I took riding on the street seriously. Things sure have changed. When I was a teenager/early 20s, I raced MX. It was totally different. What we did back then was more comparable to AHARMA vintage MX today. No crazy stunts, no climbing off the bike while 10' in the air (I doubt we ever got more than a foot off the ground) no mid air backflips. Even Evel Kneivel wasn't dumb enough to do crap like that. BMX went the same way. My daughter was involved in BMX for a couple of years. That meant racing. On an ABA track, with the proper gear. I made it clear to her that if I ever saw her with pegs on a bike, my sponsorship would end. Fortunately she never went that way. Now there is "freestyle" MX, BMX, mountain biking, skateboarding, etc. I see this thing as a "freestyle" streetbike.

And I guess that is all I have to say about that.

About the CT70, I wanted one of those when I was a kid. I also think they are cool. But again they were and are completely incapable of being ridden like this thing.
 

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I asked when I stopped by the dealer today and they said they have a bunch of them ordered and can't wait till they arrive. They already have several pre-sold.
 

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I don't like to see much of anything banned. If you want to kill yourself on a bike this new one is as good as any. At least it's low powered enough that it's not going to hit someone at 150mph. If it wipes out a rider or two, well that's what happens to young people who have more guts than brains.
 

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Vintage Rider
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Not banned, just made non street legal. I do not think supersport bikes should be street legal either. They are not designed to ride in traffic, and it is virtually impossible to ride them slow. Sell them for track use only, where they belong. There is a reason ATVs and MX bikes are not street legal. They are not designed for the street, and are not safe on the street.

There is a lot of support in the AZ legislature to clamp down on criminal behavior by those who ride these street legal roadracers. There are plenty of laws in place already. Riding more than 20 mph above the speed limit is a class 3 misdemeanor. Doing wheelies, stoppies, or dragging your knee on the road in curves are all considered reckless driving. But first you have to catch them, and they know the cops won't chase them at high speeds. So now they are looking at other ways to stop them. And they have my full support. These are not mature responsible motorcyclists. They are common criminals, endangering the public's safety. Do you think cars should be allowed to go over 100 mph on the street? Two less wheels is about the only difference here.
 
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