[1999JagWing]

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Can anyone out there in wing land tell me the difference between the Hypoid Gear Oil specified in the maintenance manual and a full synthetic gear oil?:?



The reason i am asking is i use full synthetic 75-90 gear oil in my semi, and i have a few GALLONS of it and i am wondering if i can use it in the rear on the 99 1500se.

I would "prefer" to use full synthetic because i think it is better than "regular" oil, but i do not know what the word "HYPOID" means. Does anyone have an idea if i can use full synthetic in the scooter?



Thanks for the info.

 

[Hobie1]

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"Hypoid
Hypoid gear sets are a form of bevel gear, but offer improved efficiency and higher ratios over traditional straight bevel gears. Commonly found in axle differentials and used as the ring and pinion gears, hypoid gears are used to transmit power from the driveline to the axle shafts. Because of the spiral design and sliding action of Hypoid gears extreme pressure additives are required." (taken from the Amsoil site) My thinking is that if you're using "gear oil" of 80-90 weight, you shouldn't have any issues. But that is my opinion only, use at your own risk. However, that being said, I also run synthetic 80-90 gear oil in my differential. I change it every season.

Regards,

Hobie

 

[1999JagWing]

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Thanks Hobie1 and 1500winger.
I am going out right now and change out the 10 year old (i guess)oil and replace it with my full synthetic. I figure if it can hold up to the rigors of pulling 80,000 pounds for 11 hours at the time in all seasons, then it MIGHT be able to handle my fat azz for a few hours.



Man, i changed out the oil, and the stuff in the bike was almost BLACK. I guess it was the original stuff. At least i feel better knowing that the new full synthetic is in there.



Thanks for the info.

 

[Shimmy8]

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A few years ago, GM switched from 80w90 Hypoid Gear Oil to a full synthetic 75w80 in the rear diff, in doing so they dropped the fluid level about 3/4 of in an inch.
They were having problems with the pinion bearrings going out in cold weather on the front diffs of the 4X4 trucks and to fix that concern they had the dealers replace the 80w90 with 75w80 synthetic and this cured the concern.
I have been running synthetic in the front and rear diff of my ATV for about four years, improved the fuel milage a little and rolls out of camp in the cold mornings much easyer.
So I belive you should have no problems.

 

[Big Cahuna]

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I think the biggest difference you'll find is the price. I bought a qt of 80/90 wt store brand gear oil at napa and it cost about $3. The Castrol synthetic gear oil was almost $14. so I felt the cheap stuff has worked for 27 years, why mess with success.,,

 

[Lloyd]

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What ever you do....DO NOT USE PENNZOIL there fully synth gear lube....it foams like crazy...have photos of it...! I use amsoil as a rule, but this time I was out of my beloved amsoil and went to pennzoil....BIG MISTAKE...! Lets see if I can post a photo of what came out...!

 

[Lloyd]

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This is what I mistakenly used...never again...I just use whats left as a FLUSHING oil for the gear box...thats all...!

 

[Hobie1]

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It doesn't look right. Almost like it's got water in it. With the weight advertised, it should be thicker. Your Amsoil might of not liked the change.:ssshh:I wonder how it was still foamy coming out of the differential after sitting for a while.

I use synthetic 80-90w and it takes a while to drain.

Anyway, I'm not buying any of that stuff. Somethings not copacetic.

Hobie

 

[Lloyd]

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Now I bet a number of you are wondering how long this oil was in there....you want to trys about 5 minutes....! Let me explain this. When I do a oil change back there I use whats left of the PENNZOIL as a flushing oil to get what ever gear wear and so on particals are in there....to flush it out before I put the good stuff in.



Now to get the PENNZOIL to do this...all I had to do was drain the gear box...refill it with the pennzoil stuff....put the bike on the centre stand....start it and put it in 5th gear and let it run at a idle in most part for a few minutes. Then when I stopped the engine and climbed under...and removed the drain plug...this is what can out...nothing but FOAM...! I did the same with the amsoil...foam....what foam...there was nothing, just a hint of air bubbles in it showing that it was running....otherwise just good solid oil came out.....not soap suds...!



So on my last gear box oil change which was yesterday in fact...I used that crappy pennzoil as a gear box flush...and took photos of what comes out with just a few minutes of the bike running on the centre stand in gear.

 

[Lloyd]

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Hobie1 wrote:

It doesn't look right. Almost like it's got water in it. With the weight advertised, it should be thicker. Your Amsoil might of not liked the change.:ssshh:I wonder how it was still foamy coming out of the differential after sitting for a while.

I use synthetic 80-90w and it takes a while to drain.

Anyway, I'm not buying any of that stuff. Somethings not copacetic.

Hobie

Trust me there is NO water....in there what so ever. I have a new GL1800 and I have been doing oil changes in the rear unit ever 5,000 Km's during its break in so that the great bulk of the wear in particals are gotten outa there. Once the bike hits the 30,000 Km's point then it will be reduced to a oil change once a year...maybe once ever 2 years, depending on how many KM's I put on it in any given year. So far I have had the bike for just about 6 months now...and have put 22,000 on it since it was new. Gee can you tell I ride...just a little....



Clearly pennzoil in the GL1800's gear box does not work out....it foams like crazy and this is NOT good...!



Lloyd

 

[Hobie1]

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Okay Lloyd, thanks for the info. Safe riding to you.:action::waving:

 

[Lloyd]

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Hobie1 wrote:

It doesn't look right. Almost like it's got water in it. With the weight advertised, it should be thicker. Your Amsoil might of not liked the change.:ssshh:I wonder how it was still foamy coming out of the differential after sitting for a while.

I use synthetic 80-90w and it takes a while to drain.

Anyway, I'm not buying any of that stuff. Somethings not copacetic.

Hobie

By the way...sitting did not help...have photos of that to...it took...get this...this is nuts. It took almost a FULL hour of sitting for the foam to go down...! I have photos of it every 5 minutes...and its a huge foaming mess for 15 minutes...only after 15 minutes has about 50% of the foam gone down....it took near a hour for it to return to a more normal looking state. It might work will in other types of gear boxes...but as far as the GL1800 goes....pennzoil was a huge failure.

 

[exavid]

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I wonder if it isn't just because the Pennzoil and Amsoil aren't compatible? Gear oil is gear oil, at least the non-synthetics are for the most part, well loaded with sulphur which can't be used in engine oil anymore due to EPA regs. But synthetics are a different animal and might have compatibility problems with other types.

I prefer regular old dino 80/90 SAE stuff in my truck, cars and bikes. It's worked well for a lot of years for me and I've never had a problem with differentials or final drives. My old '93 1500 ran for 170,000 miles with the stuff and is still running in good shape for it's new owner. Both final drive and the engine used dino oil for their whole lives with no serious wear.

 

[Midnight Express]

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I have run Penzoil's dino and synthetic gear oil in my 50,0001 mile 1200A.

I did not change the oil for the first 15-20 thousand miles, and the rear end went out. After, that, I have every 2-4k.

I usually swap the oil after a ride, when it is still warm, and have never seen even a bubble. It always looks just like it did when I put it in.

 

[Lloyd]

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Midnight Express wrote:

I have run Penzoil's dino and synthetic gear oil in my 50,0001 mile 1200A.

I did not change the oil for the first 15-20 thousand miles, and the rear end went out. After, that, I have every 2-4k.

I usually swap the oil after a ride, when it is still warm, and have never seen even a bubble. It always looks just like it did when I put it in.

You know what the funny part is...I have some Pennzoil not there fully synth stuff....but I have or should I say had the DINO version. And it did NOT foam. Only the fully synth one foams like crazy for me at least. Maybe its a bad batch, hell if I know all I do know its that it foam like crazy and looks like soap suds, and lots of it!



So I posted that as a warning for all to be very carefull with that stuff as it "might" lead to a drive unit failure as a result of the oil turning to mess of foam.

 

[Midnight Express]

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Lloyd,

Ya, that is some serious foam. I think it is like exavid stated, probably does not mix well with Amsoil. I think I put the synthetic in a gearbox in my combine, so now you have me curious. I think I will check it when I get it out this fall running corn, Lord Willing.

By the way, my wife and I also have a 2010 Red Metallic base model 1800. What a machine. We have about 14,000 miles on it. I have changed to rear oil in it 4 times, and have been using Honda's hypoid. Anyways...

Thanks for the warning.

ME

 

[Lloyd]

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The thing is I am NOT mixing it with the amsoil gear lube at all....! I drain the amsoil, and then put the drain plug back in and fill it with the PENZ and just run the bike on the centre stand in 5th gear for a few minutes to flush out gear case from any loose gear wear metals and such that is / or might be still in there. Then I drain it and let it drip out till it dry as dry can be. Then I put fresh Amsoil gear lube in.



So if there is ANY amsoil still in there...in just so very little that it should be nothing worth talking about. So I really have no clue as to why this stuff foams so bad, only that it does foam and not a little...!!!



Since the bike is still new there will be stuff coming off the gear for some time till they get fully lapped in to each other, and it is this stuff that I want to get out of there during this break in time. Once the GW hit say about the 30,000 to so mark, then I will do it as a once yearly thing.



And let me tell you for the first 10,000 or so I put in it, there was a lot of stuff coming off the gears and so on as they did the great bulk of the break in. As I said maybe this PENZ stuff if ok for other types of gear boxes and might not foam in there, but when it comes to the GL1800's gear box, it crazy how it foams. Maybe having hypoid gears have something to do with it...I really do not know. I can tell you this much there is nothing that is harder of lube oils then hypoid gears as it has a sliding movement to them...just the way the gear mesh with each other...



Amsoil gear lube does not foam....no other gear lube I have ever used has ever come anywhere near or even remotely near faoming like this PENZ fully synth does. Maybe its a bad batch....hell if I know...but I am not going to ever chance a set of gears on finding out...they just cost way to much to play that game.



Oh....and don't forget to clean your drain plug off real good. It is a magnetic drain plug after all...!

 

[Lloyd]

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Midnight Express wrote:

Lloyd,

Ya, that is some serious foam. I think it is like exavid stated, probably does not mix well with Amsoil. I think I put the synthetic in a gearbox in my combine, so now you have me curious. I think I will check it when I get it out this fall running corn, Lord Willing.

By the way, my wife and I also have a 2010 Red Metallic base model 1800. What a machine. We have about 14,000 miles on it. I have changed to rear oil in it 4 times, and have been using Honda's hypoid. Anyways...

Thanks for the warning.

ME

You might want to give Amsoil a try one day. I got turned onto it because it was the only company I ever found that not just gives spec on there oils, but also tests them and gives YOU the customer the results of how it did. That somehow spoke volumes to me. Real life tests results and not just talk on how " so and so " has there whiz bang 2000 super duper...flash in the pan oil that will do this...that...and the other thing....and has NO proof to show that it does any of what they claim. So that how I became a Amsoil oil fan in part.

 

[rpeters549]

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I have been very happy with the Valvoline synthetic. About 10 clams a quart and I change it annualy so it lasts about 5 years. I will say I have used Amsoil products before and they are great.

I would not use any Penzoil product except in desperation, and even then it would be drained ASAP.

 

[HyperPete]

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I use the Amsoil in my M109R's rear, and replace it every time I do an oil change. I plan to change the gear oil in my Aspencade at my next oil change and begin the same thing - Amsoil and changing the oil in the rear at every oil change. My M109R uses just under a pint. I don't imagine that the various GoldWings use a lot more...