Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums banner

Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
imported post

:? I have a '81 Goldwing and just rebuilt the front calipers and master cylinder. I replaced the bleeders on the calipers with Speed Bleeders. After going through about 3 quarts of brake fluid, I'm still getting very tiny air bubbles entrained with the fluid. I'm using the master cylinder to purge the fluid through the calipers. I checked all the fittings to ensure they are tight. Does anyone know what I'm doing wrong? Is the master cylinder pumping the air in? Any help is greatly appreciated.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,882 Posts
imported post

are the brakes spongy? are the speed bleeders seating well? you shouldn't get air unless air is getting into the systme....

have you let the whole system sit over night (allowing bubbles to raise to the top?

have you tried just using the gravity method (opening the bleeders and allowing gravity to run the fluid into the system?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
789 Posts
imported post

Top off your master cylinder, put the cover on and pump the lever 10 times SLOWLY. When you have brake fluid coming out, you will have air in the line until you crack the banjo bolt at the master cylinder. This may take 4 or 5 times. Be careful, it will spurt out. Most important, wrap a rag around it while you do this so you don't spill a drop on anything below. Brake fluid will eat your fairing overnight.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
12,779 Posts
imported post

Looks like you got lots of help sooooo let me say :waving:Hello and Welcome to the Steve Saunders family .
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
231 Posts
imported post

I second cracking the banjo bolts. Also, put the cover back on your master cylinder, zip tie your front brake lever to the grip and leave it over night. I had the same problem as you and after trying these two things, my front brakes were good to go.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
imported post

Thanks everyone for their suggestions.

I just tried bleeding the brakes after letting the bike sit overnight two days. I did get some air out at the bleeders but the lever just squeezes all the way to the handle bar even with successive pumping. The bleeders are seated well as far as I can tell.

The levers doesn't have any resistance at all.

I like the idea of bleeding the banjo nut. I'll try that tomorrow after letting the bike sit overnight again.

Calflash - you mentioned about bench bleeding the master cylinder. What do you mean?

Again, thanks for everyone's help.

 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
59 Posts
imported post

It could be the Master Cylinder rebuild,did you do a rebuild,I had this problem after a rebuild,the wallswhere the little piston enters was scratched,so when the lever is pulled in,then it sucks air between wall of cylinder & piston,I worked it out by chance,I tried the master cylinder from a CX500 & it worked great,so I just replaced the MC,some say that these scratches can be removed using emery paper.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
789 Posts
imported post

You probably won't get anything at the lever until you crack the banjo bolt at the master cylinder a few times. Pump it slow, hold it in, crack the bolt several times. 4 or 5 times of this and you should feel the pressure come back. The same thing when you bleed the clutch. Remember, wrap a rag around it and don't let so much as a drop on any plastic.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
284 Posts
imported post

I've worked on many (100+) different type vehicles over a span of 35 years and I've never, ever come across any hydraulic brake system that's as difficult to bleed as the GL1100.

I dunno what is going on (angles, elevation, routing, connection types, etc?) but without a power bleeder you'll never get a hard lever. Yes, you can work the banjo nut, tap on the lines, let it sit for days, make offerings, sacrifices, etc. You'll get it to kinda work but never solid enough for a panic stop.

Save yourself the trouble and search for "power bleeder" and you'll find some different DYI approaches. Store bought PB isn't bad $$$ and worth it if you do maintenance/repair work on other vehicles.

Good luck
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
789 Posts
imported post

A power bleeder is probably the easiest way to go like AirCutoff says and I'm thinking one of the reasons these bikes are so difficult to bleed is how the angle and or tilt position of the master cylinder on the handle bar. If there is air in the system, it's going to be at or near the banjo bolt. I've done this basic procedure on many cars and bikes, latest on my 750 a couple weeks ago and have rock solid lever and great braking. Too bad there is not a bleed valve on the master cylinder. You'll pump the lever all day until you crack the bolt. Just my experience.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
imported post

I have an Actron bleeder but it doesn't work well with the Speed Bleeder I have on the calipers. What I might try doing is replace the SB with the traditional one so I can use the Actron bleeder.

The Banjo bleeding is definitely something I haven't tried. I'm sure it doesn't help the situation when the garage temperature is 30 deg.

Oh, when I speed bleed the brakes, where should the lever be (i.e. fully and part way depressed)?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
72 Posts
imported post

Bench bleeding. run a line from your mc back into the mc resavior and pump till you don' see bubbles. Then reattach the brake line and bleed the rest of the system. That will also tell you if the mc is is the problem or you need to look at your lines, fittings, or calipers.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
155 Posts
imported post

I've had good luck pushing the fluid up through the caliper using a big syringe and a bit of plastic tube ober the bleeder. I take the MC off the handlebar and point it up to clear the bubbles there. Make sure the top's on tight tho'.

Gord
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
305 Posts
imported post

Welcome Almstl !

I just did my 81. Different from your 83 because of split brakes.

My MC wouldn't prime so I disconnected a banjo at the caliper, squeese the lever, clamp the banje between fingers and release the lever until fluid came out. did the same at the other caliper and then the same routine with the bleed valve. After primed the speed bleeders worked.

Dwight
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,223 Posts
imported post

Mike,

Since you're using speed bleeders, you could put a little teflon tape on the threads to make sure you're not sucking in any air as you bleed.

My 81 still had mushy brakes after bleeding too. I tied the brake lever down (with a little spacer so the lever didn't bottom out) and left it for a couple days, this helped a lot. I think I also tapped on the handle bars once in a while to give it a little vibration and get the air moving.

After it was "mostly good", I rode it. The brakes improved with use, over a couple weeks.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
68 Posts
imported post

I re-built my calipers, changed to SS hoses and changed my MC to a Nissin MC this summer. The first time round i just put everything to gether and did normal bleeding at the banjos, bleeders. Left it overnight with zip-tie multiple times. Just couldn't get the air out -- spent almost 4 weekends on it. I was out of my wits. I went as far as re building th orginial MC and putting that on - but nothing seemed to work.

Finally, I took every thing apart went through the following steps methodically and viola perfect brakes.

1. Bench bleed the MC
2. Connect each banjo top-down one at a time, bleeding at each connection.
3. When you are pumping the lever try this technique, 5 really slow pull-backs and slow releases, 5 slow pull-backs quick releases
4. Bleed at the calipers
5. And then reverse bleed by pushing the oil through the bleeders upwards to the MC

The reverse bleed did the trick. The air just streamed right out of the MC.

I used a syringe with PVC pipe. When reverse bleeding make sure the MC is "almost" empty else you will have oil all over the place.

Best of luck.

Regards,
Dan
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,838 Posts
imported post

Almstl,

You could have an air pocket in your master cylinder. Take the top off of it, and with it half full, pump it a few times, and weave it off for little. Refill, thenbleed one side at a time.

Nightrider1

Almstl wrote:
:? I have a '81 Goldwing and just rebuilt the front calipers and master cylinder. I replaced the bleeders on the calipers with Speed Bleeders. After going through about 3 quarts of brake fluid, I'm still getting very tiny air bubbles entrained with the fluid. I'm using the master cylinder to purge the fluid through the calipers. I checked all the fittings to ensure they are tight. Does anyone know what I'm doing wrong? Is the master cylinder pumping the air in? Any help is greatly appreciated.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,398 Posts
imported post

Interesting. I'll have to try the reverse bleed thing and report back.

Edit: Alright, I tried cracking the banjo bolt and got a tiny squirt of air. No difference in lever feel. Then I took my MityVac and forcefed fluid through the bleeder that I wrapped in teflon tape. All that did was inject a bunch of air into the line (with a loud SQUISH from the MC), so I reversed the hoses and sucked out all the foam.

Now I've got a firmer lever than before and it doesn't go all the way to the bar like before. Unfortunately I can't test it due to the crappy weather, but I'll report back on how well it does.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,103 Posts
imported post

tallnwise wrote:
I re-built my calipers, changed to SS hoses and changed my MC to a Nissin MC this summer. The first time round i just put everything to gether and did normal bleeding at the banjos, bleeders. Left it overnight with zip-tie multiple times. Just couldn't get the air out -- spent almost 4 weekends on it. I was out of my wits. I went as far as re building th orginial MC and putting that on - but nothing seemed to work.

Finally, I took every thing apart went through the following steps methodically and viola perfect brakes.

1. Bench bleed the MC
2. Connect each banjo top-down one at a time, bleeding at each connection.
3. When you are pumping the lever try this technique, 5 really slow pull-backs and slow releases, 5 slow pull-backs quick releases
4. Bleed at the calipers
5. And then reverse bleed by pushing the oil through the bleeders upwards to the MC

The reverse bleed did the trick. The air just streamed right out of the MC.

I used a syringe with PVC pipe. When reverse bleeding make sure the MC is "almost" empty else you will have oil all over the place.

Best of luck.

Regards,
Dan
:coollep:Have always wondered if this could be done but was afraid to give it a try.

:11brown:Winger 82
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top