[wolfy]

Part of the problem I'm having was posted in a different thread, but that's been fixed so I started this one.
History: Dogbone fuse blew and I finally began the process of replacing the starter solenoid as the wires were all but burned through. Got one from eBay, and that was a mistake. It was shoddy. And here's a possible hint to my troubles--for no more than one second I touched the wrong wires to the wrong place on the solenoid and I saw a very quick puff of smoke from under the seat.

I eventually ordered and installed a Honda replacement solenoid. Battery tested no good. Replaced it. Hooked everything up and hit the starter button...nothing. Neutral light glows. When I cross the poles on the solenoid the engine turns over well but will not start. Doesn't even act like it's trying. I have fuel in it.
I found that the ignition fuse was blown. Replaced it but it blows the instant the starter button is pushed.

So I'm here with the experts. Help me, somebody, cause I am losing some prime ride time!!!
Thank you!!

 

[glhonda]

Part of the problem I'm having was posted in a different thread, but that's been fixed so I started this one.
History: Dogbone fuse blew and I finally began the process of replacing the starter solenoid as the wires were all but burned through. Got one from eBay, and that was a mistake. It was shoddy. And here's a possible hint to my troubles--for no more than one second I touched the wrong wires to the wrong place on the solenoid and I saw a very quick puff of smoke from under the seat.

I eventually ordered and installed a Honda replacement solenoid. Battery tested no good. Replaced it. Hooked everything up and hit the starter button...nothing. Neutral light glows. When I cross the poles on the solenoid the engine turns over well but will not start. Doesn't even act like it's trying. I have fuel in it.

So I'm here with the experts. Help me, somebody, cause I am losing some prime ride time!!!
Thank you!!

It'll never work now, you let the smoke out of the wires!!
The puff you saw under the seat was probably some of the wire loom associated with the starter button feed to the solenoid. HOPE. Right now I'm looking into thepossibility of the silicon diode. I'll be back.

 

[glhonda]

There are two small wires going to the starter relay. A green/red and a yellow/red.
The yellow/red should have power with the key on AND the starter button depressed. This is an ignition source, so if the bike can be bypassed to crank and still not start, you need to check your fuses in the main fuse holder.
If you have power, you need to check the ground side of the relay (g/r). This wire should have continuity to ground when the bike is in neutral, or the clutch is pulled in.
There is a blocking diode that only allows current flow in one direction located under the seat in the wire loom. Maybe where your smoke came from? If this diode is open, the bike will only start with the clutch switch.
Does your clutch switch work?

 

[wolfy]

What the heck is a clutch switch?

 

[Bellboy40]

Clutch switch is a micro switch by the lever that is operated when the clutch is pulled in. It allows the bike to crank while in gear. Otherwise it will only crank in neutral.

 

[wolfy]

Oh. DUH!! So I just went out, replaced the blown ignition fuse, turned the key, held the clutch , and crossed the solenoid poles. AND IT STARTED!!! WOO-HOOO!!!

Does this mean we're getting somewhere?

 

[wolfy]

Something else I noticed while riding this afternoon- the neutral light comes on every time I squeeze the clutch handle. I don't think it did that before. What does that mean? Is it related to the starter button not working?

 

[neoracer]

its most likely related to the diode being burnt out

can find on the 87 ETM starter circuit as "clutch switch diode" but cant find it on the parts interchange to get you a part #

 

[glhonda]

31700-124-008
Silicon rectifier

 

[wolfy]

Many thanks, guys. I'll get one ordered. I should be able to actually use the starter button after this, is that right?

 

[Ken Bergen]

Many thanks, guys. I'll get one ordered. I should be able to actually use the starter button after this, is that right?

No, all that diode does is prevent the neutral light from coming on when you pull the clutch.

 

[glhonda]

Many thanks, guys. I'll get one ordered. I should be able to actually use the starter button after this, is that right?

The starter button should work if the diode is shorted.
If the diode were open, the neutral light wouldn't light with the clutch lever.
If your start button doesn't work with the clutch pulled in, then you still have a problem.
Did you check for power on the y/r as I posted?

 

[wolfy]

No, sir- I am ashamed to admit that I did not. I got so excited that the bike would actually start that I rode all day! I'll check it tomorrow, but don't be surprised if I'm back on here asking questions cause electrical stuff ain't my strong suit. I do have a tester, so I'll give it a shot.

 

[wolfy]

Question: when I put one of the probes from the tester to the g/r, where does the other one go? Ground it to the bike? Or do both probes go to it?

 

[glhonda]

Question: when I put one of the probes from the tester to the g/r, where does the other one go? Ground it to the bike? Or do both probes go to it?

Put the red lead on the y/r. The black lead on a good ground, I prefer the battery.
Turn the bike on and push the starter button. You get a voltage signal every time the button is pushed.
Current goes from the battery, to the ignition switch, to the fuse you replaced, to the start button, to the starter solenoid, to the diode, to the neutral switch, to ground.
If you don't have power on the y/r, start backtracking until you find it.
Since we know this a twelve volt circuit, you can substitute a test light for the DVOM.

 

[glhonda]

I screwed up. I reversed the color code on the wires for power and ground.
I have gone through the post and edited the mistakes. Sorry for the confusion.
Wolfy...sorry if you spent too much time chasing the wrong wire(s).

 

[glhonda]

No, all that diode does is prevent the neutral light from coming on when you pull the clutch.

This is incorrect Ken. After I screwed up the post, I figured I'd correct your mistake as well.
Ignition power comes in on the y/r wire. It finds it's ground on the g/r.
It has two paths to ground.
1) through the clutch switch
2) through the neutral switch.
The diode is in direct path for the neutral switch. If the diode were missing, or open, the bike would not start in neutral but the neutral light would illuminate.
It does keep the light from coming on when the clutch is engaged, but it is a crucial component in the starting system.
Check me.

 

[Ken Bergen]

This is incorrect Ken. After I screwed up the post, I figured I'd correct your mistake as well.
Ignition power comes in on the y/r wire. It finds it's ground on the g/r.
It has two paths to ground.
1) through the clutch switch
2) through the neutral switch.
The diode is in direct path for the neutral switch. If the diode were missing, or open, the bike would not start in neutral and the neutral light would not illuminate.
It does keep the light from coming on when the clutch is engaged, but it is crucial component in the starting system.
Check me.

Okay my post did not covered the complete working of the system but the main point was that the diode isolates the neutral light from the clutch switch.

With the diode omitted and the two wires connected directly the system would still work allowing starting in neutral or with the clutch lever pulled but the neutral light would come on each time the clutch lever was pulled which was the case here with the shorted diode.

BTW: I can't believe you screwed up. It must have been Internet gremlins screwing with your post.:lash:

 

[glhonda]

With the diode omitted and the two wires connected directly the system would still work allowing starting in neutral or with the clutch lever pulled but the neutral light would come on each time the clutch lever was pulled which was the case here with the shorted diode.

I asked you to check me and you didn't do it!!:lash:

The ground to the neutral switch MUST go through the diode.
This will not start in neutral if the diode is missing or open.`

I can't believe you didn't check!:lash: Okay, maybe just a "little" whip:whip:

 

[Ken Bergen]

I asked you to check me and you didn't do it!!:lash:

The cheque is in the mail.:raspberry: