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I know there has been many posts on this topic, but I figure I would start another.

Cold weather is here, and the cold cranking amps just does not seem to be power for the spark ignition. Colder weather,battery maybe a little down,oil a little thicker, choke is on and primed, and no start even when the starter button is released. Very irritating when you know the starter is spinning the engine at a relatively good speed.

For the ignition spark, do ya'll think the starter power draw andlow voltage juice to the ignition system affects the coil or the ECM? It can not be the pulse generator since it is a generator and not a sensor. How many amps do you think the coils and ECM draw?

There are plenty of cold winter days ahead, so I plan to use my battery chargerand bypass the coils first. Here in Texas, it is only cold in the morning, ha. Has anyone measured the secondary voltage on this goldwing coil?

I want to believe my battery is still good, but I wish it would fail so I would have an excuse to buy an Odyssey. My battery does spin the engine a little slower, but it is cold. Like I said in the past, I can start my power washer with half a pull.

After I determine if its the coil or ECM, I want to explore a DC-DC powerconverter to up the voltage with enough amps. We need an electronicguru.

I hate trickle chargers just based on principle. Like I really want to install one on all my cars, not.
 

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Your battery probably needs to be replaced.

Also, I would suggest checking all of the wiring connections between the battery and the starter and make sure they are clean and tight.

The problem is a lack of voltage on the ignition circuits during the cranking cycle. Measure the voltage right at the starter terminals. Bet it is below 10 volts...

That Odyessy battery will make a lot of difference. Did on mine.
 

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Coil or ECM?

Low voltage or not, it still has enough juice to turns my motor at a pretty good clip for a decent amount of time. I would guarantee that it would start if it had spark at the plugs or had a magneto system. Same if it had a kick starter, but it is too heavy to push.

Trying to figure the lower threshold voltage for these units.
 

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I know exactly what you are saying.

My bike would spin over at a high rate of rpm it seemed to me. But it would never, ever try to pop off until after I released the start button.

In colder weather, it would just pop and backfire occasionally without starting.

Putting in a good battery fixed all of that. I also cleaned the wire terminals and greased them just for good measure.
 

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Check your battery voltage while cranking the engine. If you get a voltage drop of more than a volt or so it's the battery causing the problem. One easy fix that usually works is replacing the spark plugs with iridium plugs. They will fire with lower voltage than standard plugs. I had a problem with my 1500 not wanting to start until I let go of the starter button, changing to an Odyssey about two years ago put and end to that. Iridium plugs cured slow starting on an 1100 I had.
 

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My lawnmower battery drops to 8.6 volts and still starts but it has a mag.

It seems that this goldwing ignition system forces us to resort to creative thinking that would not typically apply to other vehicles. In this case, I will eventually get an elaborate high performance battery knowing what I know now, and I will be glad when I do. But, I think we are just compensating. If this was any othercar or truck, we would have never been exposed or have to live with some of theseintricacies.

When my bikesits for for a few days and with cold mornings, same old story. If it was 60 degrees, I would not even notice this problem.

Instead of a charger, I wish I had a variable DC power supply to determine the minimum voltage for the coil and ECM to work just to satisfy my curiosity.

To bad they did not make a HEI coil equivalent to boost the spark voltage a few thousand. Lower voltage on the primary coil may not be enough to fire on the secondary coil.
 

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I have been using the same battery on mine for over 6 years that I bought a sealed cell one at a Batteries Plus store. I added it when I installed a SIMPRO hi output alternator. (I did this before I knew about the Compufires but so far so good) I have occasionally had problems if the bike sat for a few days and the temps are in the low 30's or below. All I have to do is put the choke on full and crank the throttle a couple times. And I do use a battery maintainer especially if the bike is going to sit for a few days. I have an older version of this one: http://store.schumachermart.com/sem-1562a.html I think I paid about $30.00 for it and it has a permanent cable that attaches to the battery. That makes it real easy to use and was money well spent.
 

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Foosman(5) wrote:
If this was any othercar or truck, we would have never been exposed or have to live with some of theseintricacies.
The difference between the bike and a truck or car is that to keep the weight down a smaller battery is used, ditto the starter. If the bike is well maintained and everything is working as it was designed to it will work as it should. Most 'Wings do, and have for a couple decades for that matter. Aircraft have similar problems, normally if the engine doesn't fire up right away the battery fails even though the aircraft engine does have a magneto. It's a matter of lightweight components. If you want a lead sled you could have a big battery and super powered starter.
 

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exavid, I can agree with you to a certain point, but I do not think I can convince you to go back to a standard lead acid battery. But,that was the design of the bike. If a battery is to be replaced every 1 or 2 years then so be it and we would not like that at all.

I am sure my bike, your bike, and may others are properly maintained. Many out there maynot even know there is a "better" battery. Most will go with the standard replacement, which again we know they may have that uneasy feeling of starting the engine upon release of the button. In a different application, that same battery may last twice as long. When my battery fails or becomes subpar for a goldwing, it will probably work great in my lawnmower.

I do agree that the battery is also physically small and limits the CCA. If I could have put in a cheaperlarger garden tractor battery with high CCA, I am sure many would. With the space limitation, the Odyssey sound like the best alternative taking cost, CCA, power, and reliability into consideration. But, most people away from this forumprobably never heard of this battery. Lucky us.

I do not know about aircraft batteries any more or available GSE. I do remember handproping several recips in our test cells and flight linewith magsand impulse coupler.Just enough rotational speed on the mags and the engines busts over.

Many cars and trucks with weaker batteries will still start the engine unlike the goldwing. Even if your car or truck engine is cranking slowly, I would venture to say it would still start.In extreme cold weather, about any car or truck will more likely start with less effort than the goldwing. I really did not mean for this post to be a discussion on the battery since this has been exploited many times.

This was my real question:

For the ignition spark, do ya'll think the starter power draw andlow voltage juice to the ignition system affects the coil or the ECM? It can not be the pulse generator since it is a generator and not a sensor. How many amps do you think the coils and ECM draw?
 

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How cold are we talking about? At low temps, I would twist throttle quickly about 4-5 times, give it about 1/2 to 3/4 enrichener, and hit starter. It'd fire instantly. Almost too quick, as the oil pressure isn't up as quick.

The ECM draws very little. It's job is to sink the coils, so the coils get batt.+ then the opposite sides go to the ecm, and the transistors in the ecm, sink the coils to ground. The same for the pump. I never measured the ecm draw, but I doubt it's an amp. I really don't know about the coils, but, that'd be intermittent, so the average isn't going to be that high. Try closing the plugs to minimum, and make sure the center electrode is very flat with sharp edges. (no roundness) I actually thought of doing a invertor at one time, but never did do it, as I figured that would just be one more thing to fail. If battery, coils, and plugs are in good order, you shouldn't need that invertor.

Is your headlight going off when you hit the start button? Make sure that it does. Try starting it with a jumper cable set off your vehicle (vehicle not running). If it fires instantly, it's battery time. A lot of batterys can crank the engine a long time, but the surface voltage takes a large dive right off the get-go. A good AGM batt. is a good way to go. There's a lot of good opinions about Odessey, but I think the Yausa, or Dekka is very good, also. I had an Odessey in my LTD, left the thing in park position, but also left the tail light on, for about 3 days. It took a long time to get that battery charged up. Then, about a week later, it completely died. It died instantly, and totally. I got another one free, luckily. But, that made me think, maybe that Odessey isn't so tough after all. The tech guy on WingWorld seems to think highly of Dekka.

I actually had very good luck with wet batteries. I have used Wal-Mart and Interstate batterys with good success. Even with Compufire. I doubt they'd start the 1500 in 0 degree weather, but they started fine at 35>.
 

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I actually had very good luck with wet batteries. I have used Wal-Mart and Interstate batterys with good success. Even with Compufire. I doubt they'd start the 1500 in 0 degree weather, but they started fine at 35>.

I too believe that I have had reality good success with a Walmart Interstate. Here, you would still have less problems, with a car or truck.At zero, I would saythat may start to affect many vehicles.At 35F over a few days or a week, youprobably would havea problem.

In cold weather, try and notprime or set the choke and hit the starter once or twice for a few seconds. By then,your battery maybe too low to successfully start the engine due to what I believe is a weak or no spark.

I agree the ECM draws very little low amp, and I would have guessed 1-3 amps. But, I wonder at what voltage below 12vdc does the ECM become non-functional.Example: Allison transmissions provides a system integration manual forOEMs to follow their guidelines for wiring and installation. Power requirements for the transmission ECU provide a voltage range for power requirement as such when setting up a dyno test cell. Like I said, I am going to initially start investigating the coils.

The spark has always appeared weak looking to me. I have seen other engines with weak spark that seemed to run fine. Each volt lost on the primary side, probably looses a couple of thousands volts on the secondary side. If there is a weak spark to start with, then the loss of voltage during starting would make it just than much worse.

I actually think the ECM is affected more at low voltage, but I do not want to spike it and accidently blow it up, yet.
I actually thought of doing a invertor at one time, but never did do it, as I figured that would just be one more thing to fail. If battery, coils, and plugs are in good order, you shouldn't need that invertor.
Exactly!! I am just curious as which item fall out first. Then one can experiment with separate power source (battery charger) or inverter to boost the voltage to that specific unit.
 
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