That's where the Clymer manual is so handy. They've done their best to try to capture and illustrate the changes over the model years, and with the California models.
GL1500 stall
I just bought a used 1991 1500 with 93,000 miles. It seems to be in pretty good shape, but the PO has no service records and the bike needs some attention. The price was right, but I should have looked her over better and test-rode her longer.
Last night I was riding with a passenger (maybe 350lbs. total). Temps were in the high sixties and we got into some traffic. Sat and idled for several minutes at a time. Went maybe a mile idling at lights and creeping along. Several times the bike stalled or almost stalled when taking off from a stop. Seemed to idle ok and ran ok once we got moving. Started right up when I killed it, but I'm not sure what the stalling means. The temp guage needle was pointed straight up when we were in traffic and dropped back down when we got moving again.
Where should I start troubleshooting?
HoganJr
Last night I was riding with a passenger (maybe 350lbs. total). Temps were in the high sixties and we got into some traffic. Sat and idled for several minutes at a time. Went maybe a mile idling at lights and creeping along. Several times the bike stalled or almost stalled when taking off from a stop. Seemed to idle ok and ran ok once we got moving. Started right up when I killed it, but I'm not sure what the stalling means. The temp guage needle was pointed straight up when we were in traffic and dropped back down when we got moving again.
Where should I start troubleshooting?
HoganJr
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Clymer Manual
1. Where is the Air Injection Valve on a 1990 or 1991 and what does it look like?
2. Where are the One-Way Valves and what do they look like?
3. The #4 Green Hose: Is that the large-diameter hose that comes out of the front-right corner of the Air Box?
In trying to track some of these hoses some of them go under the manifolds and I lose track of them. I can't always wiggle one end and see any movement anywhere else and I'm reluctant to really tug on anything because I really don't want to remove the manifolds to re-attach anything. Any tips or tricks in all this effort would be greatly appreciated.
Thank You
hoganJr
I got my Clymer Manual over the weekend and have begun to study the diagrams, match the networks on the bike with the pictures and troubleshoot the systems. I have a couple of questions that I thought I'd bring to you all for your assistance.That's where the Clymer manual is so handy. They've done their best to try to capture and illustrate the changes over the model years, and with the California models.
1. Where is the Air Injection Valve on a 1990 or 1991 and what does it look like?
2. Where are the One-Way Valves and what do they look like?
3. The #4 Green Hose: Is that the large-diameter hose that comes out of the front-right corner of the Air Box?
In trying to track some of these hoses some of them go under the manifolds and I lose track of them. I can't always wiggle one end and see any movement anywhere else and I'm reluctant to really tug on anything because I really don't want to remove the manifolds to re-attach anything. Any tips or tricks in all this effort would be greatly appreciated.
Thank You
hoganJr
1) The main valve is between the 2 intake manifolds and under the carbs, it looks like a EGR valve from a car. The solenoid valve looks like a mini hand grenade and is attached to left frame tube above horn (my ride) and is nothing more than a barometric pressure sensor..
1. Where is the Air Injection Valve on a 1990 or 1991 and what does it look like?
2. Where are the One-Way Valves and what do they look like?
3. The #4 Green Hose: Is that the large-diameter hose that comes out of the front-right corner of the Air Box?
hoganJr
2) One way valve is more commonly called a vacuum check valve, usually white small half inch diameter it allows vacuum to flow in one direction only. This would be towards the device so at times of low engine vacuum device does not get starved for vacuum. One way valve of air injection is larger and can be seen by main valve from above.
3) #4 hose would be the one that goes to RF of box.
carb rebuild
OK, I ordered a Randakk rebuild kit and I began disaasembly of the carbs. I got one float bowl off and pulled the float and valve, no problem. Pulled the main jet. Now what? I am following along in my Clymer and referencing the (94) Honda Manual, but should I just keep tugging and wiggling the main jet holder until it pops off? And what's up with the slow jet? I've got a pair of mini-channelocks that I tried to grip it with, but it does not turn. It looks like a smooth brass cylinder with a hole in the top.
I don't want to damage anything, but it's all gotta come apart!
hoganJr
OK, I ordered a Randakk rebuild kit and I began disaasembly of the carbs. I got one float bowl off and pulled the float and valve, no problem. Pulled the main jet. Now what? I am following along in my Clymer and referencing the (94) Honda Manual, but should I just keep tugging and wiggling the main jet holder until it pops off? And what's up with the slow jet? I've got a pair of mini-channelocks that I tried to grip it with, but it does not turn. It looks like a smooth brass cylinder with a hole in the top.
I don't want to damage anything, but it's all gotta come apart!
hoganJr
Personally myself I'd just be checking to ensure the orifices aren't clogged/gummed up. Spray carb cleaner, and appropriate sized nylon bristle brush type material is what many guys use for this kind of thing. Some of the smaller orifices might require some real ingenuity to find something suitable. The goal is not to change the orifice diameters or damage 'em in any way. The smaller idle circuits (pilot jets, etc.) tend to be the ones that usually gum up.OK, I ordered a Randakk rebuild kit and I began disaasembly of the carbs. I got one float bowl off and pulled the float and valve, no problem. Pulled the main jet. Now what? I am following along in my Clymer and referencing the (94) Honda Manual, but should I just keep tugging and wiggling the main jet holder until it pops off? And what's up with the slow jet? I've got a pair of mini-channelocks that I tried to grip it with, but it does not turn. It looks like a smooth brass cylinder with a hole in the top.
I don't want to damage anything, but it's all gotta come apart!
hoganJr
thanks, DM, I need all the advice I can get. What I'm thinking is that I need to disassemble the carbs to clean all the jets and passages. The stalling problem that I am having is very likely a leak in the vacuum hoses or clogged passages in the carb, either of which will cause the bike to run lean and "stumble" off idle.
I think that is what I've learned from this thread. So since I have the carbs off and anticipate pulling them apart to clean them effectively and verifiably I want to install all new rubber as I reassemble. I hope to do this once in my life.
I'm just a little hesitant to tug too hard on the main jet holder until I know that it comes off just by pulling it off. And I'm looking for some tips on how to remove the slow jet.
hoganJr
I think that is what I've learned from this thread. So since I have the carbs off and anticipate pulling them apart to clean them effectively and verifiably I want to install all new rubber as I reassemble. I hope to do this once in my life.
I'm just a little hesitant to tug too hard on the main jet holder until I know that it comes off just by pulling it off. And I'm looking for some tips on how to remove the slow jet.
hoganJr
Ultrasonic cleaning
I have successfully used ultrasonic cleaning to clean carbs. Absolutely the safest/best way to degunk a carb IMO. You have to really ensure the cleaning fluid used is safe to use on aluminum (and rubber O-rings) tho. Also, forgot to mention previously that compressed air is very helpful in cleaning clogged orifices.
I have successfully used ultrasonic cleaning to clean carbs. Absolutely the safest/best way to degunk a carb IMO. You have to really ensure the cleaning fluid used is safe to use on aluminum (and rubber O-rings) tho. Also, forgot to mention previously that compressed air is very helpful in cleaning clogged orifices.
does the jet holder just pull off or is attached somehow?
is the slow jet threaded or does it just pull off?
DR
is the slow jet threaded or does it just pull off?
DR
Go back and re-read the carb overhaul part of Jim Martino's web site, he has an exhibit showing which parts come off and which stay.
http://www.jmartino.me/carb/carb3.htm
http://www.jmartino.me/carb/carb3.htm
thanks, I am good again...for nowGo back and re-read the carb overhaul part of Jim Martino's web site, he has an exhibit showing which parts come off and which stay.
http://www.jmartino.me/carb/carb3.htm
hoganJr
Float Height
OK, I'm cleaning and reassembling the carbs and it looks like I have a float height issue. I installed the float valve, needle and floats. Then I hold the carb kinda sideways and let the needle seat in the valve and let the float tang rest against the little nipple, but not so that it depresses the nipple. The Clymer book says I should measure 7.5mm from the carb body to the float arm. The 94 Honda service Manual measure with the float level guage.I don't get it. Should I be measuring to the top of the float (the greatest dimension)? If so I'm measuring like 11mm. Does it mean where the float arm attaches to the float? It so, then I need to adjust the other way.I'm sure the answer to this question is very simple, but...Please help!HoganJr
OK, I'm cleaning and reassembling the carbs and it looks like I have a float height issue. I installed the float valve, needle and floats. Then I hold the carb kinda sideways and let the needle seat in the valve and let the float tang rest against the little nipple, but not so that it depresses the nipple. The Clymer book says I should measure 7.5mm from the carb body to the float arm. The 94 Honda service Manual measure with the float level guage.I don't get it. Should I be measuring to the top of the float (the greatest dimension)? If so I'm measuring like 11mm. Does it mean where the float arm attaches to the float? It so, then I need to adjust the other way.I'm sure the answer to this question is very simple, but...Please help!HoganJr
You would think there would be some step by step instruction to set the floats on these but I could never find any.
When I did my carbs I tilted the carb so that the tang on the float assembly contacted the needle assembly just enough to close the valve but not enough to press in on the spring on the needle assembly/ (this works a lot better with a helper)
Then I set the very top (highest point) of the float (the other side from the needle) 7.5mm to the carb body.
This is how I did mine, my bike seems to run alright but maybe some one else will comment.
When I did my carbs I tilted the carb so that the tang on the float assembly contacted the needle assembly just enough to close the valve but not enough to press in on the spring on the needle assembly/ (this works a lot better with a helper)
Then I set the very top (highest point) of the float (the other side from the needle) 7.5mm to the carb body.
This is how I did mine, my bike seems to run alright but maybe some one else will comment.
thank You ByronM, that's pretty much how I did it. One float was set at about 11mm and the other was even higher. That may be the biggest cause of my original problem!HoganJrYou would think there would be some step by step instruction to set the floats on these but I could never find any.
When I did my carbs I tilted the carb so that the tang on the float assembly contacted the needle assembly just enough to close the valve but not enough to press in on the spring on the needle assembly/ (this works a lot better with a helper)
Then I set the very top (highest point) of the float (the other side from the needle) 7.5mm to the carb body.
This is how I did mine, my bike seems to run alright but maybe some one else will comment.
Check your idle speed *800 +/- 50.
Adjust with the knob located inside the fuel compartment door if needed.
Most set the idle at the mark located between the 500 & 1000 rpm mark, the one with no number on it.
Adjust with the knob located inside the fuel compartment door if needed.
Most set the idle at the mark located between the 500 & 1000 rpm mark, the one with no number on it.
back on the road
my '91 is back on the road! Sorry I didn't take any pics of the reassembly. I kinda had my hands full and wanted to keep moving along.
The floats were set too high by 3 or 4mm and I'm sure that was a problem. I replaced the float valve assemblies in both carbs. When I reassembled I discovered that the carb-to-manifold "boots" were loose on the manifolds. That was no doubt the cause of some of my greif.
One of the POs had "buggered" the head of one of the clamp screws in an attempt to tighten it. So it was a real bear to get apart. I can't believe how difficult it was to get the radiator fans back in. I took the left one off to access the shot air valve and tubing. I took the right one off to reinstall the big air tube to the breather box. I cannot believe something that comes out so easy goes back in so hard!
I'm still a little disappointed that some of my body parts are damaged and some are missing. But I can work on that while I'm riding!
Thanks for walking through this with me.
I still need to fine-tune the carbs, but I'm gonna spend some time riding and studying the manual before I dive in again.
Thanks to all!
HoganJr
my '91 is back on the road! Sorry I didn't take any pics of the reassembly. I kinda had my hands full and wanted to keep moving along.
The floats were set too high by 3 or 4mm and I'm sure that was a problem. I replaced the float valve assemblies in both carbs. When I reassembled I discovered that the carb-to-manifold "boots" were loose on the manifolds. That was no doubt the cause of some of my greif.
One of the POs had "buggered" the head of one of the clamp screws in an attempt to tighten it. So it was a real bear to get apart. I can't believe how difficult it was to get the radiator fans back in. I took the left one off to access the shot air valve and tubing. I took the right one off to reinstall the big air tube to the breather box. I cannot believe something that comes out so easy goes back in so hard!
I'm still a little disappointed that some of my body parts are damaged and some are missing. But I can work on that while I'm riding!
Thanks for walking through this with me.
I still need to fine-tune the carbs, but I'm gonna spend some time riding and studying the manual before I dive in again.
Thanks to all!
HoganJr
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Congrats! Must feel good to get it back on the road.
I appreciate the congrats. This project was a real challenge for me.Congrats! Must feel good to get it back on the road.
HoganJr
Hogan, I just read through this entire thread...due to I'm having similar issues with my '88. Please keep us updated if these 'fixes' corrected your idle and stumbling problems.
Did you have to replace ANY vacuum lines?
Did you have to replace ANY vacuum lines?
MagFarm, I can now set the idle at what looks like 800 or so on the tach and it holds steady. It does not "hunt" and "surge" like it did before.
When I take off from a complete stop I just release the clutch nice and easy and she rolls out. This blows my mind. With the GL1000 you have to slip the clutch and roll on some throttle in a synchronized effort to get her to roll. It's not hard, but you have to do it right. With the 1500 I just release the clutch nice and easy and away she goes.
I can't explain why the PO set the floats so high. A mm or two could be just sloppy work, but they were both set 3 or 4 mm high.
The lower clamps on the carb intake boots were loose and I can't understand that either, because both were tightened as far as the clamps would allow. There was a spacer around the screw between the two ends of the clamp that limited how tight the clamp could go. On one side the PO had rounded out the phillips head trying to tighten the screw further. The boots seemed soft and pliable, not like they were old and hard. I took out the spacers, replaced the bad screw and tightened 'em up.
I did not replace all the "tubing". It looks to me like the manifolds would have to come off in order to do that. Many of the hoses are formed and curved in special ways. And I cannot resolve the issue of why I have no Shot Air Solenoid Valve even though I have tubing for it and I don't notice any deceleration problems. I replaced the direct manifold-to-manifold tube. I tested every tube I could get my fingers on both ends of and put a clip on anything that needed it.
Good luck sorting out your issues.
hoganJr
When I take off from a complete stop I just release the clutch nice and easy and she rolls out. This blows my mind. With the GL1000 you have to slip the clutch and roll on some throttle in a synchronized effort to get her to roll. It's not hard, but you have to do it right. With the 1500 I just release the clutch nice and easy and away she goes.
I can't explain why the PO set the floats so high. A mm or two could be just sloppy work, but they were both set 3 or 4 mm high.
The lower clamps on the carb intake boots were loose and I can't understand that either, because both were tightened as far as the clamps would allow. There was a spacer around the screw between the two ends of the clamp that limited how tight the clamp could go. On one side the PO had rounded out the phillips head trying to tighten the screw further. The boots seemed soft and pliable, not like they were old and hard. I took out the spacers, replaced the bad screw and tightened 'em up.
I did not replace all the "tubing". It looks to me like the manifolds would have to come off in order to do that. Many of the hoses are formed and curved in special ways. And I cannot resolve the issue of why I have no Shot Air Solenoid Valve even though I have tubing for it and I don't notice any deceleration problems. I replaced the direct manifold-to-manifold tube. I tested every tube I could get my fingers on both ends of and put a clip on anything that needed it.
Good luck sorting out your issues.
hoganJr
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