Steve Saunders Goldwing Forums banner

Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
929 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
imported post

Hi All

so I thought I was being slick and now I'm not so sure

I have a 86 aspy that for some time now has had a very small oil leak from the front mechanical seal, I know it was being caused by the WP shaft beginning to wobble

this I learned here on this forum:readit:



so in an effort to keep the oil off my boots and side boxes I came up with this briliant idea that I would just plug the weep hole and drain it of oil every couple days. I figured once I saw it leak water for the first timeI would break down and make the repairs to replace the WP and front seal

so it's been months and months and this has been working out well

but alas I let it go for a while between draining because it got to where it would only be a few drops each time

so one day I see the temp climb a little, not running hot just up like 1 bar

I check the water and it's low in the surge tank so I top it off

the next morningafter riding to work I see sludge dripping from the overflow tube of the surge tank,, uh oh,,, so I take the cap off and stick in the ole finger and out comes sludge, I check oil and it's full and clean as can be



so is it possible that the engine cooling could have pulled the oil from the weep hole back into thecooling system then found it's way upto the surge tank



I had a small leak at the lower radiator hose alsoand it was clean antifreeze :stumped:



I'm not sure what I'm seeing here, but it's not moving till I get it fixed



I guess now is a good a time as any as I have my new rear tire and drive seals to install now as well



also what's the best place to but the OEM waterpump and mechnical seal

I found it for about 150.00, does that sound about right for a WP
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,965 Posts
imported post

someone will come along with the to help been lucky so far have two 1100's and only

promblems so far have been fork seal leaks
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
991 Posts
imported post

Fitting a new water pump will probably fix the problem. Oil sludge tends to rise it's way to the top of the system, and that is why you see it in the expansion tank and not lower down at the leaky hose.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,175 Posts
imported post

When the water pump fails completely you will get water in your oil. If you get enough water in the sump so that the oil pump picks it up you will be trying to lube your bearings with water. This generally is when the engine sizes up.

steve
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
929 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
imported post

Thanks for the link Dennis, what I had found was online and was + shipping

Steve, are you saying that even if I hadn't plugged the weep hole when the WP fails it will put water in the oil

I guess I better drain my oil and look for water,there could be some in the bottom of the case I guess
thanks for that info as I didn't realize that

So next question is how hard is it gonna be to get that mess out of my surge tank and the rest of the system
any good methods other than taking it all off and cleaning it, that sure doesn't look like it would be fun
can I use a flush like you would in a car
I use Tide to flush car radiators out, would that be OK
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,171 Posts
imported post

I would just flush it with the old one on then drain everything..Then flush the system(Water with the pump off. Then put everything back together and flush the engine drain and then refill you should have everything pretty clean by then. Something similar to what you have to do to the 6.0 ford diesels when they blow the cheap EGR/Oil cooler. Did it with a friends bike and we used super clean to run through system. Cleaned it all out.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,175 Posts
imported post

AJ1200 wrote:
Thanks for the link Dennis, what I had found was online and was + shipping

Steve, are you saying that even if I hadn't plugged the weep hole when the WP fails it will put water in the oil

I guess I better drain my oil and look for water,there could be some in the bottom of the case I guess
thanks for that info as I didn't realize that

So next question is how hard is it gonna be to get that mess out of my surge tank and the rest of the system
any good methods other than taking it all off and cleaning it, that sure doesn't look like it would be fun
can I use a flush like you would in a car
I use Tide to flush car radiators out, would that be OK
the back seal in the waterpump is all that is between the coolant and the oil sump.
ceasefire49 has the right plan for cleaning the system.

steve
 

·
Junior Grue
Joined
·
8,153 Posts
imported post

Steve, I count six seals between pressurized oil and the coolant, five seals and an o-ring between the oil sump and coolant.

AJ1200, yes plugging the weep hole was a mistake and the reason you got oil in the coolant. When you replace the pump be sure to replace the oil pump seal or you'll soon have oil leaking from the weep hole that you'll of course unplug.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,175 Posts
imported post

Ken Bergen wrote:
Steve, I count six seals between pressurized oil and the coolant, five seals and an o-ring between the oil sump and coolant.

AJ1200, yes plugging the weep hole was a mistake and the reason you got oil in the coolant. When you replace the pump be sure to replace the oil pump seal or you'll soon have oil leaking from the weep hole that you'll of course unplug.
ken:

Your apparently counting the seals on ether side of the sealed bearings. They become irrelevant when the bearings fail ( the cause of waterpump failure almost by definition)
which leaves the seal behind impeller as the last barrier between the cooling system and the oil system. At least that's the way I see it.

I'm describing a fully failed pump not one that's just starting to go. I've seen water in the oil at very early stages of waterpump failure but it's much more common the longer the pump is run once the bearings begin to fail.


Steve
 

·
Junior Grue
Joined
·
8,153 Posts
imported post

SuperSkypilot wrote:
ken:

Your apparently counting the seals on ether side of the sealed bearings. They become irrelevant when the bearings fail ( the cause of waterpump failure almost by definition)
which leaves the seal behind impeller as the last barrier between the cooling system and the oil system. At least that's the way I see it.

I'm describing a fully failed pump not one that's just starting to go. I've seen water in the oil at very early stages of waterpump failure but it's much more common the longer the pump is run once the bearings begin to fail.


Steve
It's really quite academic Steve.

Oil leaking through the bearings will drip out the weep hole and coolant leaking through the impeller seal will also drip out the weep hole.
Plug the weep hole and the two will mix.:shock:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,175 Posts
imported post

Ken Bergen wrote:
SuperSkypilot wrote:
ken:

Your apparently counting the seals on ether side of the sealed bearings. They become irrelevant when the bearings fail ( the cause of waterpump failure almost by definition)
which leaves the seal behind impeller as the last barrier between the cooling system and the oil system. At least that's the way I see it.

I'm describing a fully failed pump not one that's just starting to go. I've seen water in the oil at very early stages of waterpump failure but it's much more common the longer the pump is run once the bearings begin to fail.


Steve
It's really quite academic Steve.

Oil leaking through the bearings will drip out the weep hole and coolant leaking through the impeller seal will also drip out the weep hole.
Plug the weep hole and the two will mix.:shock:
ken:

Your right it's a classic case of treating the symptom rather than the problem.

steve
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
929 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
imported post

yes plugging the weep hole was a mistake and the reason you got oil in the coolant. When you replace the pump be sure to replace the oil pump seal or you'll soon have oil leaking from the weep hole that you'll of course unplug.

I plan to replace the WP and the mechanical seal, this all started with the oil seal leaking, I knew it was being caused by the WP but it wasn't leaking so I decided to wait untill it started leaking to make the repairs
I just didn't think that if it mixed in the small cavity between the 2 it could get into either the motor or cooling system. Lesson learned


Thanks for all the input so far, I may have more questions once I start the repairs, but I will open a thread for that
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,451 Posts
imported post

Ken Bergen wrote:
SuperSkypilot wrote:
ken:

Your apparently counting the seals on ether side of the sealed bearings. They become irrelevant when the bearings fail ( the cause of waterpump failure almost by definition)
which leaves the seal behind impeller as the last barrier between the cooling system and the oil system. At least that's the way I see it.

I'm describing a fully failed pump not one that's just starting to go. I've seen water in the oil at very early stages of waterpump failure but it's much more common the longer the pump is run once the bearings begin to fail.


Steve
It's really quite academic Steve.

Oil leaking through the bearings will drip out the weep hole and coolant leaking through the impeller seal will also drip out the weep hole.
Plug the weep hole and the two will mix.:shock:
X2 Ken.



The ONLY way for coolant to come out the weep hole is for it to go fully through the bearing (!).



IF I were to ever get another 4 banger Wing, I would install a NEW waterpump, then tap the weep hole and run a hose up to the handle bar and back down; this way I could SEE if/when it leaks.





Bill
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
929 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
imported post

OK so I'm getting all the parts together so I can get my bike repaired, but I have run into a snag
using the link to westernhonda I can't seem to figure out which seal I need, ie the mechanical oil seal that is leaking on the other side of the water pump

is it the seal at the end of the shaft for the oil pump ???

also it looks as though I am going to be removing the timing belts AND gears to get to the seal in question
is this correct or can I get to it without removing all that
of course I think I need to remove my trans cover as I think it's leaking anyway
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,451 Posts
imported post

The waterpump can be changed without removing the timing belt covers. There are many o-rings, but only one 'seal'; yes, the seal goes on the shaft from the oil pump (the shaft that drives the waterpump). The waterpump has sealed bearings on the coolant side.

I can tell you that the older MF the dealers had did not show one of the o-rings, so if you got everything shown you were still one part short. They might have fixed that in the last 20 years, but who knows.... Please note that not all parts people know anything about working with the parts.



Bill
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top