Synthetic Oil and Gear Oil
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Do a search on this site for "synthetic oil".. There are about 6 pages of good info regarding comments on what oil to use.. The rear differential takes any standard 80/90 gear lube, but there are many many discussions on engine oil..
I don't use synthetic oil in my 86 Aspy, however, it's a matter of personal preference.. I believe you can safely change over to synthetic from fossil, but there is concern about whether you can go back to fossil once using synthetic.. When these bikes were built, there was no synthetic oil readily available, and Honda had it's own recommended fossil type. I believe all oils are fossil based, but the additives and manufacturing process makes them "synthetic".
Good luck and do plenty of reading on this very touchy subject... :battle:
Do a search on this site for "synthetic oil".. There are about 6 pages of good info regarding comments on what oil to use.. The rear differential takes any standard 80/90 gear lube, but there are many many discussions on engine oil..
I don't use synthetic oil in my 86 Aspy, however, it's a matter of personal preference.. I believe you can safely change over to synthetic from fossil, but there is concern about whether you can go back to fossil once using synthetic.. When these bikes were built, there was no synthetic oil readily available, and Honda had it's own recommended fossil type. I believe all oils are fossil based, but the additives and manufacturing process makes them "synthetic".
Good luck and do plenty of reading on this very touchy subject... :battle:
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After owning over 50 bikes and being part of nearly as many forums and participating in about as many oil threads I promised myself I'd never weigh in again. Oh well. My engineering experience has allowed ME to come to this conclusion about oil for bikes.
Change oil/filter at or more often than owners manual indicates
Use a brand name oil in recommended weight range (make sure to avoid the "energy conserving" oils usually only available in the lighter weights anyway). I usually recommend the old SG rated oils if you can find them. I think valvoline sells a reasonably priced SG bike oil.
Use the OEM or equiv filter
Anything better than the above (high grade filters, more often changes, synth blends or full synth) will Probably extend the life of your engine and/or transmission, by who knows how much.
What do I do?
Mobil 1 (or more recently the Shell Rotella T 5w/40), automotive filter equivalent, changes about every 4K.
Each to his own - that's part of what makes this so much fun!
After owning over 50 bikes and being part of nearly as many forums and participating in about as many oil threads I promised myself I'd never weigh in again. Oh well. My engineering experience has allowed ME to come to this conclusion about oil for bikes.
Change oil/filter at or more often than owners manual indicates
Use a brand name oil in recommended weight range (make sure to avoid the "energy conserving" oils usually only available in the lighter weights anyway). I usually recommend the old SG rated oils if you can find them. I think valvoline sells a reasonably priced SG bike oil.
Use the OEM or equiv filter
Anything better than the above (high grade filters, more often changes, synth blends or full synth) will Probably extend the life of your engine and/or transmission, by who knows how much.
What do I do?
Mobil 1 (or more recently the Shell Rotella T 5w/40), automotive filter equivalent, changes about every 4K.
Each to his own - that's part of what makes this so much fun!
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Hi folks,
I have een using synthetic oil,(Mobil1) since it came out. I used Mobil1 in a1989 1500 wing when it had about 40,000 miles on it.
I use Mobil1 in a Dodge Caravan since it had 1,000 miles on it. I bought a Ford F150 with 148,000 miles on it, and switched over to Mobil 1. I also used it in a '93 4 cyl. jeep that I bought when it had 77,000 miles . I sold it when it had 130,000 miles.
The reason I use Shell Rotella in my Goldwing are mainly to see how it would be any different than Mobil1, and many Goldwing owners use and recomend it.
TOJ
Hi folks,
I have een using synthetic oil,(Mobil1) since it came out. I used Mobil1 in a1989 1500 wing when it had about 40,000 miles on it.
I use Mobil1 in a Dodge Caravan since it had 1,000 miles on it. I bought a Ford F150 with 148,000 miles on it, and switched over to Mobil 1. I also used it in a '93 4 cyl. jeep that I bought when it had 77,000 miles . I sold it when it had 130,000 miles.
The reason I use Shell Rotella in my Goldwing are mainly to see how it would be any different than Mobil1, and many Goldwing owners use and recomend it.
TOJ
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leolarry wrote:
At the moment I use that 20W50 Amsoil in mine since Mobil 1 changed their 15W50 formula about 10 months ago. (have had real good results with Mobil 1 15W50 prior the change but can't get all the tec data on the new formula so lacking data I made the change to Amsoil)
I run the synthetics all year (About 10,000-15,000 miles March-December) & when tested at 4000 miles the 20W50 Amsoil showed a 20W40 viscosity with little degradation of the oil. I personally like to change when the viscosity shears down to 20W35 so have a test sample out for testing at the moment at a little over 8500 miles.. I usually change the oil filter at about 3000 miles but the last one I cut open at 3100 miles using the 20W50 Amsoil showed almost no metal particles (from trans shifting) so will probably go to 4000 on the next filter. It's looking like the current 8500 miles might be a safe limit on the Amsoil so that would be 2 changes per summer. I'm waiting on the oil testing results but will probably drop the oil & filter anyhow. I ALWAYS install fresh oil before winter storage (no engine start-up, just crank up oil pressure after the new oil is installed) so it's looking like 2 changes per riding season will work for me. Probably could do without the oil testing, when I start hearing the valve lifters clattering the oil has probably sheared to under 10W25 weight hot so should be replaced even if the additive package is still holding up..
Twisty
leolarry wrote:
leolarry, the Amsoil will work just fine in your Wing.. They make a couple of very fine motorcycle oils in both 10W40 & 20W50.. If the weather is fairly mild & you don't ride when the temp gets much below 30°F the 20W50 will give you a quieter engine for a longer time than 10W40 & will definitely be quieter than the Dino oils after 1500 miles of use.. (most Dino 10W40 oils will shear down to 10W20 or even lower by 1500-2000 miles)
At the moment I use that 20W50 Amsoil in mine since Mobil 1 changed their 15W50 formula about 10 months ago. (have had real good results with Mobil 1 15W50 prior the change but can't get all the tec data on the new formula so lacking data I made the change to Amsoil)
I run the synthetics all year (About 10,000-15,000 miles March-December) & when tested at 4000 miles the 20W50 Amsoil showed a 20W40 viscosity with little degradation of the oil. I personally like to change when the viscosity shears down to 20W35 so have a test sample out for testing at the moment at a little over 8500 miles.. I usually change the oil filter at about 3000 miles but the last one I cut open at 3100 miles using the 20W50 Amsoil showed almost no metal particles (from trans shifting) so will probably go to 4000 on the next filter. It's looking like the current 8500 miles might be a safe limit on the Amsoil so that would be 2 changes per summer. I'm waiting on the oil testing results but will probably drop the oil & filter anyhow. I ALWAYS install fresh oil before winter storage (no engine start-up, just crank up oil pressure after the new oil is installed) so it's looking like 2 changes per riding season will work for me. Probably could do without the oil testing, when I start hearing the valve lifters clattering the oil has probably sheared to under 10W25 weight hot so should be replaced even if the additive package is still holding up..
Twisty
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I found out something from a local wing mechanic that runs his own shop, been working on wings for years, he found out by looking at the engines (wing) using a Diesel Oil (Shell Rottela is an oil for diesel) is too good of an oil for the engines and he said it doesn't allow the rings to clean the cylinders off completely causing problems later on. Now this wasn't my quote but his, He recommends using a Motorcycle Oil. He will sell you any kind of oil that you need but he recommend Golden Specter Oil, wich is a blend of dino and synthetic. I got my wing with 74K on it and now have 87K, spent allot of money in different oils, blends, synthetic and dino, and I didn't like the engine noise. Ended up back to my old favorite Castrol 20W50. Engine sounds the best with it. As long as you change it regularly and use a good oil you should be fine. But the prior owner said he only used diesel oil in my wing when he had it, he was a truck driver. I'm wondering if I will have problems later. Interesting statement about diesel oil though. I really trust Rich and I don't think he would tell me that just to get me to by any other type of oil. I have to admit he has seen a multiple amount of wing engines for as long as he has worked on them. He is Honda Certified, he did work at a Honda shop but when it closed down years ago he opened up his own prvate shop.
I found out something from a local wing mechanic that runs his own shop, been working on wings for years, he found out by looking at the engines (wing) using a Diesel Oil (Shell Rottela is an oil for diesel) is too good of an oil for the engines and he said it doesn't allow the rings to clean the cylinders off completely causing problems later on. Now this wasn't my quote but his, He recommends using a Motorcycle Oil. He will sell you any kind of oil that you need but he recommend Golden Specter Oil, wich is a blend of dino and synthetic. I got my wing with 74K on it and now have 87K, spent allot of money in different oils, blends, synthetic and dino, and I didn't like the engine noise. Ended up back to my old favorite Castrol 20W50. Engine sounds the best with it. As long as you change it regularly and use a good oil you should be fine. But the prior owner said he only used diesel oil in my wing when he had it, he was a truck driver. I'm wondering if I will have problems later. Interesting statement about diesel oil though. I really trust Rich and I don't think he would tell me that just to get me to by any other type of oil. I have to admit he has seen a multiple amount of wing engines for as long as he has worked on them. He is Honda Certified, he did work at a Honda shop but when it closed down years ago he opened up his own prvate shop.
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tpwood wrote:
That Rotella T diesel rated engine oil is probably one of the best dino oils available & for him to say otherwise is showing his oil ignorance.
As ar as engine noise goes that 20W50 oil you are using is definitely a quieter running oil than the 15W40 Rotella T, but that has nothing to do with the oil brand, it has to do with the initialviscosity.. That 20W50 is fair amount thicker than the Rotella 15W40 (at least for while).. Problem is; that Castrol 20W50 will shear down to 20W30 or so after a thousand or so miles & the Rotella T will do the same but won't lose as much viscosity per 1000 miles as the Castrol will so at (a guess on my part here) around 2000 miles they will be comparable hot viscosity..
Let us know how quiet that engine is after a 1000-1500 miles or so?
You should be glad the previous owner used a diesel rated engine oil asmost of thosehave excellent engine protection & anti wear additives & even more important a very very good anti-acid package so oil acid related engine damage during winter lay-up is less apt to be a future problem..
There nothing wrong with that Castrol you are using now it just uses a lot of long chain polymers to achieve the 20W50 rating so is more prone to shearing than some other oil's.. It sure won't hurt your Wing & is probably a bit better than the the original Honda spec oil that came in your bike..
Twisty
tpwood wrote:
Tim, your mechanic Rich might be a decent Wing mechanic but he sure doesn't know much about engine oil.. There is no such thing as oil that is too good.. Certain oil's contain additives that are not correct for certain engines & different oil's have additives that can effect engine systems like clutches, or trans shifting, or catalytic convertersbut as far the rings not cleaning the cylinder walls, that is just plain false.
That Rotella T diesel rated engine oil is probably one of the best dino oils available & for him to say otherwise is showing his oil ignorance.
As ar as engine noise goes that 20W50 oil you are using is definitely a quieter running oil than the 15W40 Rotella T, but that has nothing to do with the oil brand, it has to do with the initialviscosity.. That 20W50 is fair amount thicker than the Rotella 15W40 (at least for while).. Problem is; that Castrol 20W50 will shear down to 20W30 or so after a thousand or so miles & the Rotella T will do the same but won't lose as much viscosity per 1000 miles as the Castrol will so at (a guess on my part here) around 2000 miles they will be comparable hot viscosity..
Let us know how quiet that engine is after a 1000-1500 miles or so?
You should be glad the previous owner used a diesel rated engine oil asmost of thosehave excellent engine protection & anti wear additives & even more important a very very good anti-acid package so oil acid related engine damage during winter lay-up is less apt to be a future problem..
There nothing wrong with that Castrol you are using now it just uses a lot of long chain polymers to achieve the 20W50 rating so is more prone to shearing than some other oil's.. It sure won't hurt your Wing & is probably a bit better than the the original Honda spec oil that came in your bike..
Twisty
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Well I got aboout 2500 on th oil now and getting a little pinging now but not bad, The only thing I can say about Rich's statement is he has pulled many engines apart and has seen the conditions, I know I am an A&P mechanic and can't figure that out either but I do know the sometimes what the theory may be when the rubber meets the road it may be different, and I can't see Rich making it up, so I do take his experience into account. Just thought I would pass that on for future referance.
Well I got aboout 2500 on th oil now and getting a little pinging now but not bad, The only thing I can say about Rich's statement is he has pulled many engines apart and has seen the conditions, I know I am an A&P mechanic and can't figure that out either but I do know the sometimes what the theory may be when the rubber meets the road it may be different, and I can't see Rich making it up, so I do take his experience into account. Just thought I would pass that on for future referance.
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tpwood wrote:
I have over 40 years of experience & could never come close to making a statement like that.
Twisty
tpwood wrote:
I would like to getthe phone number of Rich.. It seems he can tell just by looking at an engine what damage was oil related & can even tell the type of oil caused the damage or whether the damage was oil related & not caused by lean running, or lack of oil changes, or poor maintenance, or other owner abuse.. .. The company I work for could really use a guy with his talents.. We currently have to take the engine apart tofirst qualify & measure all the internal parts, then use ONLY a single brand & type of oil in the engine, keep very detailed records, & either run the engines alone on a Dyno for hundreds or even thousands of hours under tightly controlled conditions with frequent oil analysis & filter checks or run the vehicles on strict durability driving schedules under exacting weather & dust conditions with very exacting details of any oil added & very strict oil change intervals.. At the end of testing the engine must come back apart to re-measure & record any & all wear findings & in a lot of cases the parts must be sent out for metallurgical analysis.
I have over 40 years of experience & could never come close to making a statement like that.
Twisty
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Your mechanic may have been talking about using a synthetic on a new engine. Conventional wisdom from a few years back suggested that piston rings didn't seat against cyl wall very well if a new engine was run with synthetic. Much of that goes out the window with the fancy new cyl wall coatings like Nickasil - I'm not sure what the various years of GL's have. I have worked on several older airhead BMW's with cast iron liners and no coatings where the rings NEVER properly seated because the bike was run on synthetic from new. Bob
Your mechanic may have been talking about using a synthetic on a new engine. Conventional wisdom from a few years back suggested that piston rings didn't seat against cyl wall very well if a new engine was run with synthetic. Much of that goes out the window with the fancy new cyl wall coatings like Nickasil - I'm not sure what the various years of GL's have. I have worked on several older airhead BMW's with cast iron liners and no coatings where the rings NEVER properly seated because the bike was run on synthetic from new. Bob
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tpwood wrote:
tpwood wrote:
I wouldn't suspect Rich is making it up either, but in many years of working on various types of engines, I never heard that one. I've used DELO 400 in just about everything I've ever owned. It's definitely a diesel engine oil, comparable to Rotella dino version. Never had a problem. If the rings can't wipe the oil off the cylinder walls I'd say that was a good deal, the rings and cylinder would last forever.
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OK Sorry to open up a big can of worms! And NO your not getting his phone nuumber, he gets me good prices on stuff, I was just relaying a comment, I know what you all are saying and agree with you all. WWWHHHEEEEWWWWW!! Sorry!! Never Again:shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock:
OK Sorry to open up a big can of worms! And NO your not getting his phone nuumber, he gets me good prices on stuff, I was just relaying a comment, I know what you all are saying and agree with you all. WWWHHHEEEEWWWWW!! Sorry!! Never Again:shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock:
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I use Mobil1 in my 1996 Ford Escort which I named "Fly Hooptie". Also started using it in an old VW bus after rebuilding the engine a few seasons back. Any oil changes, I collect the old oil and burn it in my lawn tractor "Big Moe" which smokes so bad, it's killed every mosquito in Middle Tennessee and been implicated in the untimely demise of a couple of close neighbors. But never proven...
Beazer
I use Mobil1 in my 1996 Ford Escort which I named "Fly Hooptie". Also started using it in an old VW bus after rebuilding the engine a few seasons back. Any oil changes, I collect the old oil and burn it in my lawn tractor "Big Moe" which smokes so bad, it's killed every mosquito in Middle Tennessee and been implicated in the untimely demise of a couple of close neighbors. But never proven...
Beazer
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