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Hi all, 01 GL1800 67K owned since new. An odd intermitted issue came up 3 times when riding home on a trip home to say the least.

1st time ran fine Hot weather to Port A Texas 95 degrees out. Left next day and at steady speed light maintenance throttle to keep speed, start surging, cutting out, NO FI light, and would not idle when stopped. If you advance the throttle it would smooth up and pull hard to however fast you want to go, slow down to under 40 you might think it was going to stall out. Would not idle , maybe 1200-1500 rpm to keep to from dying. Road it to Austin, and if you rolled the gas on and held the brakes it would stop surging. Got it home NO codes Ni History Codes. started and ran fine. Ummm Odd
Pulled top shelve tapped into throttle position sensor wire with a scope and clean actuation. Ran at night and no spark plug wire misfire, and coil saturated tested each coil makes over 30KVs. Put it together and rode it around my home no issues.

2. Went to Austin in the morning Summer, rode 2 days in the hill country, and ended up Luckenbach Tex for lunch the next day. Had lunch, left there 85 degrees and 5 miles up the road here we go again all the way home to Dallas FtWorth.
this time NO codes, Put a blanket around the front and let it idle over 60 mins... Bingo started running bad, this time I had dual trace Scope on the crank pickup, and the throttle position sensor. Clean signals and would not idle like before, and no codes. Had bought used Coils to try, the ignitors in the coils want set a code... changed all 3. Started the bike and let it run another 75 mins, blanket wrapped around the front 90 degree evening and ran fine. Bingo fixed

3. Rode 700 miles to Colorado, did 1500 miles while up there in the mountains and about 500 towards home. Stopped in Childress to avoid heat and spend the night, got up 6 am left and BINGO, back running bad again and FI light came on this time and flashed a code Knock Sensor, cant remember with one at this time. I had training to do and parked the bike last summer and just now getting back to it. But the same issue riding came back Surging, Want Idle without dying, Surges at idle , under 40 feels like it wants to quit, twist the throttle runs great.

I borrowed a 2005 GL1800 to swap the ECM, and test. A New -P00 ECM is 625.00 my cost. Has anyone seen this issue before? I was going to swap the Knock Sensors and scope test them and see if the code returns. Do the blanket warm test again, and see if I can make it start acting up. I thought the coils did it... but one of them could be bad too.. Used parts. Ebay ECM 249.99 right now... used.

But its a Honda, what is up with needing AN ECM?

I read here false Knock Sensor Codes issues and replace the ECM to fix.

I will spend the money for a new ECM if it will fix this issue! Don't need to throw good money away...

Thanks for any help!

Tex
 

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I recently was made aware of a problem with a junction connector under the air box. It is a red connector with an orange cap that makes connection to several wires. It could be corroded and cause several different problems. If not that I would bet on a bad connection somewhere else.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Ok, I Will pull the OEM manual and locate this connection. Study What connections are made through it.

Yeah, something like that could be the issue.. thanks
 

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You may be on to something...
C12 is a connector by the Rear Brake Res could be just under the shelter... and the Map/ Throttle position sensor wires join through this connection.... it also controls the Idle air valve ... connections
very possible ... erratic TPS or Map values

the pipes blacked and fuel economy came way down during the 200 miles home acting up.


the C10 and C13 are the injectors power and pulse controls... that would dead mis .. no codes ... the surging and want idle wasn’t a mis...


with the symptoms buy rolling the throttle on on and not mis or surge, it acts like a sensor value off ... but not out of range to trigger a lamp.

Thanks for the getting my mind on the possible issue.



A place to look...

Take care

tex
 

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the connector Dave is speaking of, is under the Airbox.

I ought to cut my throat for linking outside, but guess you need the help.

No FI light, cranks but won't start

that is Fred Harmon who discovered this issue, he explains in detail how to fix it. he describes how it can be frustratingly inconsistent and effect a lot of other things.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
It looks that he how power supply issue to the ECM , by testing in circuit he found the voltage fell away and not power the ECM. Unplugged the ECM power was there, indicated a connection issue. Yeah possible mine could be that, just done fit the symptoms because if the ECM lost power it would cut out , and when regain power it would cause the FI light to come on then off ... like the Right thumb control does. Off then On. Worth investing anyway, because I get the coolant smell too when cold and goes away and need possible replacement of some hoses or just tightening ... gas tank air box removal I have done before and no biggie. I have a look too and see if this connector is documented and what other circuits are in the connector.

after reading his post I understand the ECM was getting power interruption, causing no start / run issues. No FI light when key on.
No power present when ECM was plugged in.
As a test I can actually use a scope meter and test the ECM power input if I can get this bike to act up ... and watch for voltage fluctuations.

but this good to know it’s there ... and it’s a hi heat area ...with potential issues.
Ford uses a wiggle test to test for bad intermittent connections like this. Power it up and start wiggling the harnesses.

Once I find this issue I post exactly what is was .
Thanks all...

Tex
 

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Ford uses a wiggle test to test for bad intermittent connections like this. Power it up and start wiggling the harnesses.



Tex
I didn't realize that was exclusive to Ford, I've been doing it for years and hardly ever worked on a Ford.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Back in the old days you could put the ECM in wiggle test and it would tone differently for you when you found a loose connection and the ECM sensed it.

Ford had some deferent ideas back in the days prior to OBD2 ... 95 earlier. Key on engine off , key on engine running and wiggle tests...


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Discussion Starter #9
Ok, shelter off, air box off, gas tank removed
From cover around coils removed too.

No Red Connector I can find. Like shown in the link pic. I ran the main harness from fuse box to up along side the left frame and the right frame....

My last intermittent issue shown up Childress Texas home to Fort Worth 200 ish miles and ran bad the whole way back. This time , hard to keep running below 1500 RPM with side stand down, but FI came on and flashed when under 1500 RPM, side stand down code 26.

Battery disconnected for 7 months, 9 months later today, I start the bike, runs fine.
No flashing FI light either. Removed seat, short check connector , history code 26.

Used an oscilloscope to test signal at ECM, followed test T in my OEM manual says check connection, run above 2500 10
Secs ... see if code returns.

See around 60 HZ frequency on both sensors at the ECM connectors.

Swapped sensors anyway, still no code and see same Frequency at the ECM pins.

Hum ...

Can’t find this red connector yet...on my 01.
Removed gas tank, air box... and front coil cover and lower cover.

Manual says G1 ground on lug at right side of engine

G2 ground back of engine under the gas tank.

Used duel trace scope to Monitor computer power inputs , while pulling on harnesses, and nothing. Tapped the relay box, nothing

Having check grounds yet ... that’s next look for power on the grounds... and next voltage drop to ECM.

Tps signal clean, map sensor clean, baro clean, all so far because it runs runs now. Ran 1:45 mins in today Texas sun, painters drop cloth over the engine where the shelter would be, and let it idle.

Before my trip, I got the bike to act up 2 hrs idling , and wrapped blanket around the front Shelter was on then... and acted up. Check crank sensor, and coil triggers... all clean.
Replaced the coils with used coils... and trouble went away for 750 to Colorado, 1500 miles there, 500 miles to Childress... last 200 home surging, want idle, and if you twist the throttle or load the engine by applying brakes it pull hard and run fine. Maintain speed ran like crap. 30-45 mph feel like
It want to quit running it surges so bad.
Load the engine a little smooths right out.
Also gas mileage goes way down during this.

I ridden it three times now with it acting up away from home. All 3 times it ran bad the entire way, stop , restart, and go again .. bad running again.

The last time home it was in the morning Hrs 79-81 degrees ..

It gives no warning, it does no start running bad during the actual ride, it’s from a cold start or let sit while eating lunch 60-75 mins and then from startup runs bad.

Once it runs bad, it doesn’t stop until you shut it off and let it sit. Next day, runs normal... for miles!!! Too


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The only thing i can think of that would do it like that is a bad solder joint on a pcb, which could be any of them
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Kinda my thinking too. I got a friends 05 in the shop with mine and pulled his ECM and verified it will connect , start and run in my 01.

I was hoping to get my acting up again and shut down restart and a couple of times making sure it was ended still acting
Up. Switch the ECM out and see...

I smell coolant every now and then cold warming up. I wanted to check all the hose connections under the tank anyway... found coolant stain at the lower right hose to head fitting the exhaust side cover. That confirmed my smell. I put a turn on the all the clamps to make sure.

He said leave at 4 am! 700 miles 1st day! Are you crazy!


The plan was trip to Montana this year... with a fellow rider, he rides a Road King. We talked about when to leave and I said I normally leave 4am 330 miles to Amarillo by 9am. Out of Texas heat by 12 noon in Taos New Mexico by 2-3 pm when I leave for the summer. 1st day 700 miles and in the cooler weather. He thinks motel after 330 miles, Amarillo...

I told him you might consider riding a different bike. Because we never Make Montana at that rate there and back in his days off allotted. He also say I ride a “plastic bike”. Well maybe he is right. But I can break 700 miles which ease.


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IF,
you ride the Interstates or a major Texas highway, you can make the miles you talk about.

IF,
you are bird watching 330 miles per day is my limit... I have to be out of the heat by 85*F or I will have a Heatstroke.

Each rider has to make their own choices.... my last long ride by myself was in 100+ heat, and I had to stop every two hours and find Air Conditioning and that was with me wearing a Phase Change cooling vest that you dip in Ice Water to try and keep your body cooled off..... Back then, I had one of those stupid Tulsa Tall windscreens.

No more!!! I bought a Madstad that will let me change the angle tilt and height on the road as needed.

I now drive my Suburban and tow the bike on a trailer behind me until I get to the rally/event location...... I can handle rides of 2 or 3 hours and that is about it for me anymore.
 

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We suffer from we having to do the 287 route to Amarillo to get to something really worth seeing . Since we live here and always head to the cooler weather, higher elevations for our big summer rides. Not much in between we are interested in seeing .. anymore so pound the miles out and get to cooler weather. Yeah 95 degrees is my point where I want to ride to be short. I haven’t trailered my wing yet, but we might look at that to Raton NM, get there and unload and then really enjoy the scenery and not sweat doing it.

Around 530 ish miles to Raton NM. I done all the entries to Colorado over the years, by roads small and major. Even some dirt these years on my adventure bike. July - August Texas 100 degrees nope not doing it. I have that t shirt already. Hell I could haul his bike behind mine on my small bike trailer. Make him ride “behind me” he he ... well maybe not. I used to haul my xr600 dirt bike behind my wing and head to Colorado back in the 90’s

He wants to see Montana ... Wyoming.. I done those states .. can’t get to them 300 a day and only have 7-10 days available and get back.


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I used to live in Dumas, TX and we loved 3 day weekends!!!
Off to Cimarron, NM or Raton, or more north if we pushed it hard....
I remember one summer, we combined a 3 day weekend with a 5 day vacation and made it to Gunnison, CO and rode our bikes up there.... we towed them on trailers so we could make a flock of knots in Air Conditioning until we reached a campsite.... then we toured in circles around the campsite...

was a lot of fun, that was about 1975 if I remember right.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Well found the jump splice connectors tapped underneath the harness. You have to look and they are there.

Mine no corrosion, clean..

Use scope to watch the ECM voltage as I twisted , pulled on the wires at that location
Steady ...

Mine power leads are white connector on my bike , yellow for grounds ... both are good





Thanks for the lead.....

Tex


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I also tried putting the ECM in the refrigerator and cold soaking it. Let the bike run with tarps to bring heat into the area and run 60 mins. Let it sit , 30 mins nothing normal.

Try slapping the ECM, again nothing....

This is an odd one for sure.


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Made it one needle width above half for 60 mins.


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When it is acting up do a power balance test, pull one spark plug lead off then on one at a time to try narrowing down which cylinders or bank are not contributing.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Well I would like for it to start acting up! I could isolate the issue... then.

I got it all back together, I ordered a used throttle body 05 14800 miles , 50.00 bucks.
Cheap part change, and have good know. ECM to change if I can’t get it acting up before I leave on my next trip. Change both and head out to Montana. Once I get back, I can isolate whether it needed an ECM.

Being I got the Code 26 before and not now it leads me to believe it might need the ECM.

Tomorrow morning I am planning on riding the bike to see if it will start acting up or set code 26 again.

X ing my fingers....


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Just a guess from an outside view.
Can you hook up your scope to the knock sensor and Map sensor to see if they are the problem when it does act silly? I would also be checking the 5 volt power supply to all (or any) sensor when it acts up.
I been at this a long time and its rare to be the ECM. I have seen a lot of mechanics replace the computer , then find and fix the real problem. l I have done it my self.
David

I am an auto mechanic, not gold wing mechanic.
 
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